Cathedral notes (#1)

To accompany this (which I’m treating as a very valuable work-in-progress [sic]), some initial straggly commentary.

(1) Conceptual genealogists will insist on a link to this, so here it is. There’s a lot of discussion stimulation there. Some other time.

(2) Probably 90% of the ‘Cathedral’ discussion so far — insofar as this has over-spilled the NRx dikes — has consisted of “why don’t we call it the Synagogue?” Tedious as this may be, it’s a crucial question, because it effectively draws the NRx contour. If the cooptation of Judaism by the main cladistic trunk of dynamic modernity is not understood, nothing has been. ‘The Cathedral’ is a term that captures the exclusive insight about which NRx coalesces.

(3) Nydrwracu’s diagram, and Radish’s, are no doubt incomplete, but they are fully adequate to the most decisive point. The Cathedral is an information system — even an ‘intelligence’ system — that is characterized, through supreme irony, by a structural inability to learn. The minimal requirement for any Cathedrogram is that it displays a radical deficiency of significant feedback links to the control core. Every apparatus of information gathering occupies a strictly subordinate position, relative to the sovereign Cathedral layer, which is defined exhaustively by message promotion. Core-Cathedral is a structure of read only memory. It is essentially write-protected. The whole of its power (and also its vulnerability) is inextricable from this feature. It is pure cultural genetics (and zero pragmatics).

(4) Because the Cathedral cannot be fundamentally modified, but only exacerbated, or terminated, there is sadly no strategic option available to its enemies that is not based upon extinguishing it without residue. Extinctions happen. Evolution is a bitch.

(5) Any argument that could imaginably pretend to perturb the Cathedral is going to be hate. The only role of rational ‘interchange’ with this entity is to expose its absolutely inflexible dogmatism. Reason cannot kill it, although it can help to demonstrate why it needs to be killed.

(6) The Cathedral is objective, supra-human insanity.

(7) We are ruled, demonstrably, by a blind idiot god.

June 27, 2014admin 39 Comments »
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39 Responses to this entry

  • nyan_sandwich Says:

    >We are ruled, demonstrably, by a blind idiot god.

    While it’s true that that description works in this context, it connotes a different entity. Let’s get our theology straight here:

    SOME FACES OF GNON:

    Azathoth: (evolution). God of biological selection and change. Pathologically short-sighted. Can be destructive or constructive depending on circumstances. Not friendly, but has been useful in the past. This is the typical referent of “blind idiot God”.

    Cthulhu: (memetics). God of ideas, religions, and left singularities. Usually destructive and dangerous. Have occasionally had reprieves where memetics were controlled by wise rulers instead of the petri-dish. “That cult would never die till the stars came right again, and the secret priests would take great Cthulhu from His tomb to revive His subjects and resume His rule of earth. The time would be easy to know, for then mankind would have become as the Great Old Ones; free and wild and beyond good and evil, with laws and morals thrown aside and all men shouting and killing and revelling in joy. Then the liberated Old Ones would teach them new ways to shout and kill and revel and enjoy themselves, and all the earth would flame with a holocaust of ecstasy and freedom.”. That which swims left. Cthulhu Fhtagn.

    Ares: (War, conquest). Historically very active in Europe and elsewhere. Not so active today, but could be.

    Mammon: (Capitalism, the Market). God of peaceful competitive economics and production. Good to trade with, not so good once you have nothing to offer. While we are intelligent enough to play, fulfills all our desires and helps us build cool stuff, but tends to desacralize and corrupt. When we (soon) become obsolete, Mammon will eat us. Will create the Singularity unless interrupted.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    There’s nothing in your dread pandemonium with the same rigid feedback insensitivity that it constitutive for the Cathedral. If Azathoth wants to truly learn about blind idiocy, he needs to go to Harvard, or work as an editor for the NYT.

    [Reply]

    Hurlock Reply:

    Hmm, this reminds me of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. Would in not be better if the four of these be presented in that way?

    The Four Horsemen of Gnopocalypse:
    (Or the dark side of the four faces of Gnon)

    Azathoth: (evolution): Pale Horseman: Death: Extinction
    Evolution is inseparable from the extinction of obsolete species. Indeed death is fundamental to the evolutionary drive. When a certain species fail to adapt, when they become inconsiderate of the laws of Azathoth, they are destined to extinction and the Pale Horseman reveals himself.

    Cthulhu: (memetics): White Horseman: Pestilence
    Memes operate very much like viral diseases who invade the body (mind) of the host and use it to reproduce themselves, continually weakening the host, before moving on to another one, after he has become too weak.
    If one is inconsiderate of the great power of Cthulhu, the White Horseman will bring about his demise through the viral spread of hostile memes. The Reformation is an example of the White Horseman coming for the Catholic Church.

    Ares: (War, conquest): Red Horseman: War
    This one is pretty obvious and doesn’t require explanation. Ares favors the bloodthirsty and the powerful, if one is weak and does not pay his respect to him via a necessary amount of regular bloodshed in his honor, the Red Horseman will bring about his enslavement by his enemies.

    Mammon: (Capitalism, the Market): Black Horseman: Famine
    Directly from Wikipedia:
    “The third horseman rides a black horse and is popularly understood as Famine as the horseman carries a pair of balances or weighing scales, indicating the way that bread would have been weighed during a famine.”
    “Of the four horsemen, the black horse and its rider are the only ones whose appearance is accompanied by a vocal pronunciation. John hears a voice, unidentified but coming from among the four living creatures, that speaks of the prices of wheat and barley, also saying “and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine”. ”
    “The statement might also suggest a continuing abundance of luxuries for the wealthy while staples such as bread are scarce, though not totally depleted; such selective scarcity may result from injustice and the deliberate production of luxury crops for the wealthy over grain, as would have happened during the time Revelation was written. Alternatively, the preservation of oil and wine could symbolize the preservation of the Christian faithful, who used oil and wine in their sacraments.”
    “Another possible interpretation of the third horseman is to interpret them as symbolic of the wealthy and the destructive power of a class gap on a society. This can be supported by the color of their horse, black, which was seen as the sign of the wealthy as they were the only ones able to afford black dye. Also, the luxury goods issue supports this perspective as does the grain (symbolic of the staples of the working class) price increase. Such price increases would only be possible if the wealthy landowners and merchants wanted to keep the poor oppressed and starving.”
    As you said “When we (soon) become obsolete, Mammon will eat us.”
    For Mammon effectiveness and productiveness is everything. When one no longer fulfills Mammon’s requirements, he becomes obsolete and the Black Horseman comes for him, through economic crises, famines, demographic catastrophes and such.

    [Reply]

    Stirner (@heresiologist) Reply:

    Only nitpick: Famine -> Scarcity -> Market.

    Otherwise, the 4 Horsemen of Gnon is a great concept.

    [Reply]

    Aeroguy Reply:

    4 is nice for mnemonic purposes, it also parallels the chaos gods of warhammer (Azathoth-Tzeentch, Cthulhu-Nurgle Ares-Korn Mammon-Slaanesh). However I don’t think we need Ares, war manifests itself well enough in both Azathoth’s demand for competition and Mammon’s thorn of scarcity. Personally I think of them like I do the Greek gods, forces of nature to be respected with a touch of fatalism.

    I’m going to nitpick my view of these gods. Azathoth is the dread god I described in chaos patch 15, the short sightedness Nyan_sandwich mentions I would describe as indifference, though both of us I think would agree that he has a weakness for selecting local maxima rather than the true maximum. Also that he doesn’t care about intelligence, r vs K selection are both valid choices in his eyes, bacteria or grey goo will do just as fine as human or posthuman intellect, whatever works.

    Mammon is made of parts that I think should remain separate. There is the god of market forces, economics, supply and demand. This is a neutral god, a god of balance, an orderly god of predictable cause and effect. He is wrathful to the extent that the thorn of scarcity which is permanently lodged in his body happens to be bothering him. The second part I consider a heresy, that there ever existed a free market, to the extent that a free could come into existence, it is unstable and would almost immediately start being controlled and/or manipulated. The third part, also a heresy, the keynesian rooted view that the market must necessarily be built around consumption, this is part of Cthulhu not Mammon. Demand is merely a reflection of what the people want, the demands of a righteous people are utterly different than the demands of a fallen people. Blaming the market for unsustainable consumption is like blaming a mirror for being ugly. Yes Mammon will corrupt and consume us, but only to the same extent that it was a mirror that turned Medusa to stone, turning things to stone isn’t an intrinsic property of mirrors. The chaos and psychology at play in the market are not Mammon but Cthulhu reflected through Mammon.

    Xoth Reply:

    The patron deity of NRx is Nyarlathothep.

    [Reply]

    Mai La Dreapta Reply:

    This is rich stuff and needs a fuller treatment than this. Should become a blog post somewhere. My main complaint is that “Ares” is a weak entry in a pantheon of Azathoth, Cthulhu, and Mammon. I suggest Huitzilopochtli as a suitable alternative.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 27th, 2014 at 6:04 pm Reply | Quote
  • Lesser Bull Says:

    Very good.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 27th, 2014 at 6:17 pm Reply | Quote
  • E. Antony Gray (@RiverC) Says:

    The Last Psychiatrist would say, “It is a massive system devoted to protecting itself from change.” in the Cathedral’s case, either a true grasp of internal-to-man or external-to-man situations would require learning certain critical lessons about reality that would require a fundamental change from the pursuit of Kiplings “Gods of the Market-place” to dread fear of the “Gods of the Copybook Headings.” Progressivism, even in and especially in its explicitly ‘anti-capitalist’ strains, is very much in the business of trying to buy and sell the moon in a pool of water. In other words, it is the difference between a man who mines and collects coal to worship it (or removes all of in in fear o’it) and one who does so to make use of it.

    On the second point, my view is that ‘The Cathedral’ does not let the Jews off the hook for their involvement and ideas, whereas ‘The Synagogue’ lets the Protestant radicals off the hook for just being used by the Jews. It takes a little bit of myopia to not see how widely these Enlightenment types fished for subversive foreign ideas, it’s clear which direction the power was flowing.

    One reason I think Shoah denial is in vogue among certain folks is that if no Jews were killed, it makes it appear that the Jews really are in control. If any amount of them – a hundred thousand, a million, six million, were killed, it’s obvious they were always just involved in a power struggle with Enlightenment’s sons, trying to secure their good graces with them through money and influence. The Cathedral is this structure where various groups come to curry favors and try to influence opinion and action. The only difference between this structure and that envisioned by some Shoah-deniers is that the Cathedral is promiscuous in absorbing foreign ideas and absorbing their power.

    So they envision a Cathedral that is weak, though somehow able to compel fear enough that other groups will try to curry favor with it.

    The History of the Cathedral then is of it draining a group dry of its power, assuming part of its essence, and then discarding it. Of course, the Jews, the Blacks, poor whites, union members and others newer to the game (feminists, queers, hispanics etc) think they will control the Cathedral and will talk like they are making the decisions. But in the end, they will be added to the diorama of shrunken heads.

    If we could have conceived of this as a fiction before we found it as a reality, we might have made some good money on books and films.

    [Reply]

    peppermint Reply:

    The reason Holocaust denial is so common is that the Holocaust in the form of millions of deaths in gas chambers did not happen. This is important because in most of the “free world”, it is illegal to say that it did not happen, even though it’s an absurd piece of “post-war” propaganda. Post-war gets scare quotes because, really, the first casualty of any war is the truth, and the fact that this piece of propaganda must be protected so strongly implies that the war is still on.

    Compare to the Rosa Parks narrative. All the cool kids on DailyKos know that Rosa Parks was hand-picked to start the boycott and intentionally made a scene when the bus driver wasn’t interested in forcing the issue. Either that narrative is no longer important enough to be protected, or they judge that the damage to the narrative isn’t great enough and it needs to be talked about so that today’s cute little proggies can learn the tricks of the trade or something.

    The Harvey Milk narrative is not up for revision.

    Gary Oldman just said that the Jews control Hollywood, Abe Foxman said that that’s an anti-Semitic canard, Gary Oldman gives a sarcastic fake apology, Abe Foxman says he’s on the phone with Hollywood producers, and Gary Oldman gives a real apology. Was this just an anti-Semitic play put on before our eyes?

    The Blacks get what they want by demanding it and getting White and Jewish liberals to back them up with more loud denunciations, threats of boycotts and legal action, etc etc. The Jews get what they want by getting what they want. Their directly self-serving actions are so qualitatively different from the other diversities that any description of how power works that ignores them is incomplete.

    [Reply]

    VXXC Reply:

    It’s hard to argue with examples like Oldman vs Foxman above.

    Of course Hollywood is a very particular case.

    The correct answer may be that this is one of a suite of opportunistic infections occurring in an immune system compromised body [America]. When our elites collapsed in the 60s there was a rush of disorders, of which this is a particularly acute and dangerous strain.

    To move from the metaphor a comparatively few had the informal restraints on their excesses – which appear to be so deeply cultural that they may be taken as given like Irish alcoholism – and without restraints went on a looting, embezzlement, fraud and pornography spree. We are still talking about a few tens of thousands among millions but the issue must be faced and dealt with, it is better to solve the problem of the guilty than to molest the innocent.

    It probably won’t work out that way.

    Group loyalty is a bitch when misplaced.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 27th, 2014 at 6:29 pm Reply | Quote
  • VXXC Says:

    Brilliant. If you’re only going to write once in awhile, make it as the above.

    That’s an artful but probably not inaccurate description of the Nihilist strain of point #2.

    Mind you there’s going to be an answer, yours is the Russian one as opposed to the [insane] German one.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 27th, 2014 at 7:39 pm Reply | Quote
  • Alex Says:

    Intriguing!

    [Reply]

    Alex Reply:

    (Also.)

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 27th, 2014 at 7:48 pm Reply | Quote
  • Dan Says:

    Don’t worry, the Cathedral is receptive to a sort of rudimentary learning, as the course of events pushes heavy lumber slowly into its thick skull.

    The yay-democracy-everywhere head of the cathedral hydra has a number of 2x4s sticking out of its skull labelled Libya, Egypt, Ukraine, Iraq, India, UK and France, and it isn’t feeling 100% right now. Ugh… feels… bad…

    As I say, a sort of rudimentary learning.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 27th, 2014 at 7:52 pm Reply | Quote
  • VXXC Says:

    If I were plenipotentiary negotiator representing – everyone else – I would still tell the Cathedral: It would appear we’ve run out of conversation.

    For they can’t make a deal of course.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 27th, 2014 at 8:04 pm Reply | Quote
  • The Word Says:

    The song is still sad no many how many times we have to hear it

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EF1iZH1F40s

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 27th, 2014 at 8:10 pm Reply | Quote
  • Cathedral notes (#1) | Reaction Times Says:

    […] Source: Outside In […]

    Posted on June 27th, 2014 at 9:27 pm Reply | Quote
  • Dan Says:

    “why don’t we call it the Synagogue?”

    Simple history. The term ‘Cathedral’ to my mind is an analogy to how the Roman Church dictated what was legally ‘true’ in Europe for the 1000 years of the middle ages. The Church defined heresy backed by the power of the state. The ‘Synagogue’ did not.

    The ‘Mosque’ might be a better term, if you are trying to capture oppression of the mind. But to most liberals, the Mosque is just some abstract diversity that they will associate with some really yummy humus and falafel.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 27th, 2014 at 11:52 pm Reply | Quote
  • Aaron Says:

    It can definitely “learn” at becoming better at very specific things. It is always getting better at politics, it is always getting better at propagating it’s worldview.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 28th, 2014 at 12:13 am Reply | Quote
  • alien_ecologies Says:

    Cathedral is Abraxas materialized: Time’s Lord: Megas-Arconii – Α = 1, Β = 2, Ρ = 100, Α = 1, Σ = 200, Α = 1, Ξ = 60 Sun Majister incarnate: Capitals Mask Invictus.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 28th, 2014 at 12:15 am Reply | Quote
  • Amon Khan Says:

    @Dan

    The Mosque? It looks to me like there’s a world war brewing between the Cathedral and the Mosque (or NWO vs. the Caliphate, if you prefer) for global dominance. The Islamists talk openly about this, and frankly seem way ahead of neoreactionaries in many respects — most notably, in their mistrust of the Jews, and in their understanding that it takes organized violence and control of territory, as well as blogging, to defeat the Cathedral/Synagogue.

    [Reply]

    E. Antony Gray (@RiverC) Reply:

    It helps having some sponsors for your roguery.

    [Reply]

    nyan_sandwich Reply:

    >their understanding that it takes organized violence and control of territory, as well as blogging, to defeat the Cathedral/Synagogue.

    As if we don’t get it. Bring this back when there are enough of us to even populate a town and then we’ll talk about blood and clay, before that, we blog because that is the only weapon we have.

    [Reply]

    Anomaly UK Reply:

    Political Islam is a client or proxy of the Cathedral, promoted, supported and used to destroy various centres of rival power within and outside the West.

    That does not necessarily mean that it cannot possibly become a threat to the Cathedral—there are rogue elements that would like to become so, and clients have overthrown their patrons before now—but for the time being, such a threat is not apparent. The Cathedral could shut radical Islam down tomorrow if it were no longer of use.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 28th, 2014 at 1:53 am Reply | Quote
  • Stirner (@heresiologist) Says:

    The term simply must remain The Cathedral. It is like applying a crucifix to a vampire.

    Progs love their assurance of being critical thinkers who happen to be in alignment with what all decent right-minded people think.

    The term Cathedral begins casting doubt on that smug self assurance. All of the prog moral preening is exposed as simple adherence to prog atheocratic religious doctrine. NPR listening is like watching Eternal World Television. Organic and gluten free food is the prog equivalent of eating fish on friday or fasting during Ramadan. College is just prog seminary school, where they learn their proper catechism in the liberal arts programs. Recycle to earn your indulgences from Gaia, and ensure that you are among the Elect.

    To expose the fact that they are believers and blind adherents to the Cathedral doctrines that have been handed down to them is a potent amygdala attack. It can be a falsification of their entire worldview, and their presumed place as the rulers of that worldview. Why bother arguing with them when you can simply mock and chide and impart a bit of dose of badthink that lingers and metastizes.

    [Reply]

    Henry Dampier Reply:

    It is an effective spear.

    I have noticed that the people who tend to object to the term tend to be nationalists who are uncomfortable with a detailed history of nationalism.

    [Reply]

    JPOutlook Reply:

    The anti-ethno-nationalist?

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 28th, 2014 at 2:05 am Reply | Quote
  • Izak Says:

    I just call it “the system” or “the establishment” without bothering to further specify what precisely I mean. No one says anything. The image of a grown man talking about the system like a fifteen-year-old punk rocker is too much of a curiosity; it’s too easy to ridicule. So it’s gone full circle and people see it for the self-aware albeit highly sincere gesture that it, in fact, is.

    [Reply]

    Stirner (@heresiologist) Reply:

    Those are prog terms, and they have well developed prog defenses towards them.

    What befuddles them is the unexpected. Racist and hater and etc. are supposed to be trump cards in any argument for them. But what happens when you casually stand your ground and refuse to apologise. And instead throw their delusion back in their face as being a bunch of cargo cult natives waiting for the Democracy Gods to one day resume delivering the manna from the skies.

    Hijack their assumptions, and use them to leverage the mockery and ridicule, and watch them melt down. You don’t need to defeat the rhetoric of your opponent….you simply have to defeat your opponent. Break him down and make him irrationally lash out in front of the crowd.

    Anonymous Conservative hammers on this point in his new (free for this weekend) ebook:
    http://www.anonymousconservative.com/blog/how-to-deal-with-narcissists-is-free-now-through-this-weekend/

    [Reply]

    Izak Reply:

    Oh, I’m not really concerned with “winning” against anyone or maximizing rhetorical effectiveness. I use the same terms I used when I was like 16, but the difference is that I slowly fine-tuned my understanding of how things actually work. I just try to tell the truth the best I can without ever saying anything I don’t believe in; this alone tends to befuddle people without any additional tricks-up-the-sleeve.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 28th, 2014 at 2:48 am Reply | Quote
  • Aeroguy Says:

    @Amon Khan
    The Islamists strength is that jihadists don’t care if they die, their weakness is that their jihadists don’t care if they die. They also have a ideological strategic weakness that the NWO has been exploiting very successfully. Once a place that was Dar al-Islam becomes Dar al-Harb again, they stubbornly will redouble efforts to take it back to the extent that they will put other conquests on hold to go back there to reclaim it.

    Polygamy is just another manifestation of hypergamy run amok (technically it’s the logic ad absurdum of hypergamy). The men and women of every place and era deserve each other. It is feminist thinking, that is blind to the power that the feminine holds thinks women are powerless and kept in line over there. They rule consumer spending as women run amok always have and their brothers can be relied on for their white knight needs. The men and women there are adversaries, which is what always happens when women’s hypergamy is indulged. They are a barbarous cul-de-sac, not a proper civilization. (Granted the Persians give me pause, but the Arabs are trash which is precisely why the NWO have been feeding them arms. I’m sure that the CIA is quite proud of the civil wars it caused in Iraq and Ukraine)

    Blogging is all well and good, such that if a singularity doesn’t come along to render monkey squabbling irrelevant in the face of machine squabbling, there will be a long dark age such that the best thing we can offer would be the preservation of our knowledge to the next great civilization of the far future.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 28th, 2014 at 5:43 am Reply | Quote
  • Imperfect Humanoid Says:

    Perhaps our insane ruler should be considered more of a blind idiot anti-God who, like the supervillian of the Lego Movie, wants to glue the world together to prevent change (a kind of ‘final solution’ to pesky regressive, reactionary, or even accelerative alternatives to progressive time-stop). But things keep changing and dying even though democratic systems have long ceased expecting the unexpected, they are ‘absent while present’ just like they’re multitudinous voters.

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    Posted on June 28th, 2014 at 5:55 am Reply | Quote
  • Hard Right Says:

    Wouldn’t the Sanhedrin be a more appropriate analogy?

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 28th, 2014 at 5:29 pm Reply | Quote
  • JPOutlook Says:

    The three component parts or three main doctrine of the Cathedral are: Anti-Whitism, Feminism, and Environmentalism.

    Interestingly these three correspond with the three parts of the Neo-Reaction trichotomy: Ethno-Nationalism, Theonomy, and Techno-Commercialism.

    Enjoy.

    J.P.O.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 29th, 2014 at 6:57 pm Reply | Quote
  • Herod Antipas Says:

    “Synagogue of Satan” seems apropos and quite dead on the money, even if I think the Jews are a red herring.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 29th, 2014 at 7:42 pm Reply | Quote
  • Anomaly UK Says:

    The Cathedral’s unresponsiveness to feedback is one thing, but to imply it is unchanging is wrong, because it contains a feedback loop of its own—the internal status competition that drives it ever onwards.

    Just how immune to correction the Cathedral is is one of the most important practical questions. Do, for instance, the partial economic reforms of the 1980s not represent some kind of reaction to failure? That is my interpretation. There is, if not homeostasis, at least a measure of damping.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    The Cathedral definitely changes — i.e. auto-exacerbates. The crucial point about its learning process, brought out by these recent diagrams, is that the levels at which real (feedback-driven) learning is enabled are strictly subordinated. The academy and high-echelon media have not learnt a ‘lesson’ from the 1980s, since they have continued to radicalize on a pre-set course. They have changed modestly, insofar as they have re-articulated the social obstacle to their designs — which now consistently known as ‘neo-liberalism’ among elite voices. What they have not done — and cannot do — is renounce their basic, constitutive social program (the spiritual mission inherited from their religious tradition).

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 30th, 2014 at 12:41 pm Reply | Quote

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