Chaos Patch (#59)

(Open thread + links)

Discrimination watch. Rehabilitated inquisition. More on de Jouvenel, plus. Eucivic engineering. Criminal law collapses. The corporate slave class. Scharlach on Dyal on D&G. Fragged Friday. Weekly roundups.

SoBL on Yemen (linking this), Russia, and Venezuela. Euro-American comparisons (1, 2). Smart-nation Singapore. World Bank make-work.

“In a fiat currency system, perception is, by definition, everything.” From Georgism to propertarian cities. The use of ‘silliness’.

Genetics of IQ (related?). Wishful thoughtlessness.

When Malcolm X met the Nazis. Down the Jewish rabbit-hole (video). Outsider trolling. Bonald on racism.

On Bork on liberalism. Can free association be recovered? Hood and Neovictorian on Hillary. Safe spaces.

A hole in the universe. Entropy and aliens. Space-elevator update.

April 26, 2015admin 68 Comments »
FILED UNDER :Chaos

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68 Responses to this entry

  • SVErshov Says:

    one of the best analysis of Russian situation.

    http://thesaker.is/what-does-putin-want-a-major-analysis-by-rostislav-ishchenko-must-read/

    interesting to note that Putin’s adviser A. Dugin found of Carl Schmitt.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 9:03 am Reply | Quote
  • SVErshov Says:

    Genetics of IQ. This whole propaganda concept seriously retarded in number of ways. most reports related to genetics and stem cells in mass media really funny, as those who writing it, does not have a clue of what he is talking about. If it is true, then all kids from smart couple must be smart, but it is not. Difference between smart parents and kids can be measured in how much kids are more retarded. Same applies to difference between kids. Considering only genetical factors, one is smart not just because he has smart genotype, but because smart genes for some reason got expressed in his brain. genetical difference between humans is 0.01%. this whole concept need some revision.

    [Reply]

    Exfernal Reply:

    How much difference would one ‘not’ make, if inserted somewhere in a computer program?

    [Reply]

    Mai La Dreapta Reply:

    Very little, unless it were on a critical codepath.

    [Reply]

    Exfernal Reply:

    Mai :La Dreapta, aren’t usually genes for retinol binding receptors “on a critical codepath”? More generally, changes in homeobox genes, I think, belong to this category, like any other ‘meta’-development genes with their effects cascading to other genes.

    My point is that
    “smart genes for some reason got expressed in his brain”
    is the other way of saying
    “he has smart genotype”.

    SVErshov, it seems that you don’t understand that alleles mean code variants of the same gene and that in different tissues the same gene might produce differently spliced isoforms (that might be regulated by its methylation, among others), which in turn alters further cell differentiation (affecting sparsity of neuronal connections in various parts of the brain, for example), Why won’t you browse the OMIM database for various genes related to brain development? http://omim.org/

    As for the epigenetic effects, I guess this kind of changes is not heritable, for example:
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2944040/

    Exfernal Reply:

    ^
    It would be: ‘retinol/retinoic acid’.

    Exfernal Reply:

    My apologies for the obvious blunder:
    “that might be regulated by its methylation”
    If only things were so easy…. Instead, the splicing process might be affected more ‘upstream’, by regulating expression of tissue-specific proteins and RNAs involved in it:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_splicing#Regulatory_elements_and_proteins

    Erebus Reply:

    I’ll agree that the article is not a good one, and that the line of scientific inquiry it pursues is very imperfectly understood. We simply don’t know much about the genetic basis of IQ.

    Having said that, your argument is circular and self-defeating.

    “one is smart not just because he has smart genotype, but because smart genes for some reason got expressed in his brain. genetical difference between humans is 0.01%.”

    Okay, so what are those “smart genes”, and what controls their expression? Surely they exist, no? Surely this is open to inquiry and can eventually be elucidated?
    ….And what are you implying with respect to that last sentence? Are you arguing for Lysenkoism and (foolishly) giving epigenetics far too much credit, or are you suggesting that small genomic differences can lead to wildly different phenotypes?

    [Reply]

    SVErshov Reply:

    I never examined what implication of recent genetical discoveries, may have on philosophy. seems too early for that, as still many topics in genetics quite controversial. gene expression and smart genes very interesting area indeed. what I want to point out is that if we talking about genetically encoded intelligence, then difference in intelligence (mostly) not in genes itself, but in the way genes function and in the way its expressed or suppressed (silenced).

    [Reply]

    Erebus Reply:

    Too vague.

    What are you basing that last assertion on? I don’t see how you can make this claim, when you know neither what these “IQ genes” are, nor what proteins they code for. In fact, you seem to know nothing at all about them.

    If you want to talk about how these smart genes are expressed or silenced, let’s talk about it. What mechanism are you proposing? Histone deacetylase, maybe? If this is the case, would you not expect blood-brain-barrier permeable HDAC inhibitors, like valproic acid or vorinostat, to increase intelligence? Yet this doesn’t seem to be the case…

    Krelian Reply:

    I take it you haven’t read this yet, SVErshov.

    [Reply]

    SVErshov Reply:

    @Krelian

    it easy to see, I’m quite fresh to NRx, I’ve been reading quite a lot for last few months, still discovering new things everyday. I do not have any intellectual or political affiliations, just trying to critically apply my previous knowledge to the ideas circulating here.

    BTW link is missing in your post. Thanks for guiding me anyway.

    [Reply]

    Krelian Reply:

    Copy and paste is a bit flakely right now, running a custom build of this browser and still getting used to the key bindings. Let’s try it again.

    Genome-wide association studies establish that human intelligence is highly heritable and polygenic

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 9:30 am Reply | Quote
  • Chaos Patch (#59) | Reaction Times Says:

    […] Source: Outside In […]

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 9:58 am Reply | Quote
  • Mark Warburton Says:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/science-news/11562374/Britain-is-experiencing-same-decline-as-Rome-in-100BC.html

    I’m stuck behind a paywall but I’m guessing this might be echoing Clark, Weiss, Nick?

    [Reply]

    Chris B Reply:

    Outstanding gibberish. Truly amazing.

    – “This increase in national confidence fuelled the desire for the First World War, but the conflict set in motion a series of biological events which would lead to the beginnings of decline.
    “Temperament has a biological basis that changes over time defining out culture and shaping our identity right down to our DNA. It is known as epigenetics.” added Dr Penman.
    “The First world war had an epigenetic effect in that mothers made anxious by the way gave birth to an unusually aggressive generation which was the main cause of the Second World War.
    “The Second World War in turn produced not only the Vietnam War but the militant anti-war students of the late 1960s.”

    [Reply]

    Mark Warburton Reply:

    A bit shaky, then? Haha.

    [Reply]

    Amon Khan Reply:

    The biggest howler was comparing modern Britain to Rome circa 100 B.C. — 300 A.D. is much closer to the mark. In 100 B.C. Rome was still expanding; the U.K. today is a rump state of a collapsed empire and a collapsed people. The fricking Islamic State is almost as big as what’s left of the British Empire, and it wants the world. If the U.K. survives another hundred years without major upheavals and invasions I’ll be very surprised.

    Zimriel Reply:

    I wonder if they mean the Republic, which was straining at itself post-Gracchi.

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 10:05 am Reply | Quote
  • Mark Warburton Says:

    His book: (http://www.amazon.com/Biohistory-Decline-Fall-Jim-Penman/dp/1443871303/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1430042846&sr=1-1)

    [Reply]

    Rasputin Reply:

    “This isn’t scaremongering this is science”. Brilliant.

    [Reply]

    Zimriel Reply:

    “Cambridge Scholars Publishing”? This is giving off a whiff of the “independent publisher”.

    Better off with CreateSpace.

    [Reply]

    Mark Warburton Reply:

    Interested in going to this? Obviously a topic close to Admin’s heart.

    http://www.meetup.com/London-Futurists/events/221734513/

    [Reply]

    Rasputin Reply:

    That looks good, if I’m in town I’ll come.

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 10:07 am Reply | Quote
  • Mark Warburton Says:

    http://www.amazon.com/Biohistory-Decline-Fall-Jim-Penman/dp/1443871303/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1430042846&sr=1-1

    His new book.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 10:09 am Reply | Quote
  • vimothy Says:

    “In a fiat currency system, perception is, by definition, everything. Paper money has no intrinsic value.”

    In general, money is someone’s liability. It makes no sense to describe liabilities as *intrinsically* worthless; their intrinsic worth is determined by what’s on the other side of the balance sheet.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 12:12 pm Reply | Quote
  • Krelian Says:

    Moldbug likes to talk about the Jacobins.

    After watching that talk by Barry Chamish, and taking into consideration this connection, is it finally acceptable for NRx to extend the conversation to the other groups?

    [Reply]

    Krelian Reply:

    And by acceptable, I don’t mean safe to discuss openly with newcomers who would only be turned away by such topics. Rather, I mean acceptable for closed door discussion.

    After all, the average person hasn’t been inoculated against mentions of “Jacobinism.” Perhaps it was Moldbug being tactful in keeping the level of discourse focused here on this former group, rather than on the latter.

    [Reply]

    SanguineEmpiricist Reply:

    Look in Burke’s writings, they were extremist jacobins fabled to be in Britain. Sort of like their red scare.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 1:14 pm Reply | Quote
  • Miskatonic U. Human Resources Says:

    ‘Down the Jewish rabbit-hole ‘
    I came across this a few weeks ago – Rothschild and Weishaupt and Frank, oh my! Crypto-Sabbateans run Labor Zionism! Those intrigued can find more here:

    http://www.barrychamish.com/2012_Radio_Programs/show_links1.html
    ctrl+F for Pressman for the relevant mp3s

    Frank appointed his daughter Eve as head of his sect and it is believed by some that they practiced incest. Perhaps there is an isomorphism between their views and the thesis in ‘Kant, Capital, and the Prohibition of Incest’ ? Eve is the antinomian Amazon called for?

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 1:16 pm Reply | Quote
  • Brett Stevens Says:

    Interesting how many of these links focus on perception versus reality. The IQ debate is really going to bust that one open, because people cannot perceive anything which is above the limits for their IQ, making smart people into “magicians” (or: “fags,” as in Idiocracy) to those below.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 1:47 pm Reply | Quote
  • Miskatonic U. Human Resources Says:

    The Moore interview:
    HMS: Do you expect that this book, Providence, will be banned and kept out of libraries on the basis of the same kinds of criticism leveled at Neonomicon?
    AM: Now, I was probably very remote and distant at the time, and didn’t hear an awful lot about those criticisms, but if I understand the situation properly now, I don’t think I would’ve been greatly distressed even if I had known more about them then. Correct me if I’m wrong, but it seems to me that this might have been the problem of people whose idea of a comic has not been modified in the last 40 years or so. These are people who, though working at libraries, are still working under the assumption that all comics are for children.

    The criticisms were ‘Moore is a rape-obsessed old white man who Doesn’t Get It’ and originate from the Left. He seems to imagine Moral Majority types started it, not the working of the Left ratchet. He may be heading to the shitlord pile where the likes of Disch, Malzberg and Ellison ended up.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 2:09 pm Reply | Quote
  • Kgaard Says:

    Been reading the De Jouvenal stuff with great interest. That is an excellent series NIO is doing. Just bought the book. Excited to read it.

    Also, there is a good new movie out, Ex Machina, with a pretty interesting treatment and discussion of AI.

    One of the themes they wrestle with is whether the robot has to be “conscious” or just “act conscious” to be considered hard AI. Also a lot of male themes in there: The brilliant inventor plutocrat is physically and mentally strong, as well as trusting of his underling. But the underling is weak and duplicitous, with what CH calls “shitlibface.”

    [Reply]

    Zimriel Reply:

    Not *totally* trusting as I recall. He did wise up at the end. Not enough though.

    There needs to be an Ex Machina thread here, maybe next Saturday after the nerds here have seen it. Topics to consider might include the Three Laws – which, of course, are not on display. Would the Three Laws make a robot seem more or less human?

    [Reply]

    Kgaard Reply:

    @Kgaard

    Yeah that’s right … not totally trusting. More like a stance of logical INTJ entrepreneurial wariness survival instinct — but with a genuine openness and DESIRE to trust.

    My viewing partner at the movie argued that the real message of the movie was that both sides need to WISE THE FUCK UP and see that the real beneficiary of their lack of trust is … the robots.

    [Reply]

    Chris B Reply:

    @Kgaard – You’re going to love what he has to say on currency in relation to the power dynamic he presents on p168. Monarchical/ state treasury dilution of the monetary base undermined the barons wealth. He who can dilute the currency, can create himself wealth and power.

    Also, curious on what you make of this given your belief in the need for a flexible monetary base – http://object.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/pubs/pdf/PA698.pdf

    Who says the Fed should be the ones determining the monetary base? and how can they remotely make a correct decision?

    [Reply]

    Kgaard Reply:

    Okay so I read that currency piece. I guess it’s reasonably true. But it’s also a bit dated: The Fed’s policy choices post-2008 are looking real good at the moment. All those doomsaying retards are off the TV screen now because their models were wrong, and thus their forecasts were wrong, and thus anyone who listened to them missed out on one of the biggest bull markets of the last 100 years.

    So to some degree the monetary reform movement is probably off the table now. There won’t be many people signing up to a seasteading colony specifically to get away from the dollar.

    Will report back on De Jouvenal when I get further into it. Pretty good so far.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 2:30 pm Reply | Quote
  • SVErshov Says:

    “Chinese Team Reports Gene-Editing Human Embryos” – there are many promising directions, but what important here is to have a sense of history. Other method, based on injection of stem cells into umbilical cord in utero, successfully used in France in Lion for exactly same genetic disease, beta-thalassemia. Children have been born disease free and now they are about 20 years old. 20 years ago we have had successful, proven and safe way to treat beta-thalassemia and for what ever reason that program was terminated and people dispersed.

    [Reply]

    jay Reply:

    Did this method eradicate the way by which beta-thalassemia is inherited? If not then Gene-editing is ultimately a superior solution considering that the other method will be just kicking the can down the road.

    [Reply]

    SVErshov Reply:

    this method creates established chimeras. means humans, who have genes from two (or more) different humans or animals. In this case because chimeras have copies of functional gene for hemoglobin it compensate for deficiencies in thalassemia patients own dysfunctional gene. there are many type of chimerism between humans or between humans and animals. One case been described when cells with Y chromosome (male) were found in woman 8 years after she gave birth to male child.

    in case of established chimerism, normal genes by chance can pass to offsprings.

    Gene-Editing by CRISPR of course superior and quite natural, because it utilize mechanism of DNA repair normally used by cells to prevent DNA mutations. Question is, if this methods will bring something functional into clinical practice. well … wishful thinking.

    [Reply]

    Exfernal Reply:

    Any changes besides the ones to germ-line cells (that pass to zygotes) won’t be inherited. So yes, it is “just kicking the can down the road”. Well, which therapy is potentially more profitable, the one-time one, or the one that requires repeating? 🙂

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 3:59 pm Reply | Quote
  • jnkkj Says:

    I was googling around if there would be anything about our admin in my native language. Came across this: http://www.nickland.fi/welcome.html

    Wonder what comes out of when you smash one?

    [Reply]

    Alrenous Reply:

    Candy XOR hyperstitious shoggoths.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 4:40 pm Reply | Quote
  • Izak Says:

    That Vice piece was surprisingly good. If anything, it didn’t go far enough in explaining the bizarre rhetoric of Rockwell and the ANP. Rockwell was a natural born carnie; he was never meant to be taken seriously, and I doubt he took himself seriously. Both of his parents were vaudeville performers, and that style of performance was always with him. The real Groucho Marx visited his mother to offer her good wishes when he was born. He also drew propaganda comics. However, the author’s comparison of Rockwell to Red Skelton is spot-on, and that’s probably the style of speaking through which he should be judged.

    There has always been a slightly Jewish performance comedy influence to the American Neo-Nazis, and it’s just as true for Rockwell as it is for Tom Metzger. Rockwell was a better performer, though. If you go watch clips of him, you really get the whole package deal of great schtick. His corn-cob pipe is a well-chosen prop. He also has a telling smirk that comes from the side of his mouth from time to time, usually after he says something ridiculous with an otherwise serious intonation. It’s as if he’s sort of communicating, “Who, me? Did I just say that?” There are some great moments where he just makes up statistics from the top of his head. I remember some Youtube clip of him saying, “I would imagine that about 80% of Jews are traitors!” without bothering to explain why.

    It’s also worth watching Tom Metzger’s confrontations with Wally George, the equally cartoonish Reaganite conservative who hosted a local talk show featuring an audience of mostly drunk/stoned college students (on it, he has some pretty great interviews with pro wrestlers and metal bands like Gwar). Metzger made a few guest appearances, and he actually managed to get Wally George on his own public-access cable TV show, which features no audience but has a pretty amusing “interrogation” style table (it looks like two big cardboard boxes glued together) with a tenebrist background and some ominous-looking “security guards” wearing fascistic uniforms. The whole thing is pretty funny; you can watch it on Youtube. At one point, one of Metzger’s “security guards” goes up and starts banging the table with a nightstick while Wally George goes, “Oh, cut it out! Your goons don’t scare me, Metzger!”

    If you’re seriously interested in politics, these Nazi guys should be avoided like the plague, obviously. But if you’re interested in the mechanics and psychology of trolling, they’re all pretty fascinating.

    [Reply]

    Zimriel Reply:

    It’s a lot easier now. What percentage of the population voted for Obama? That’s the percentage of traitors in the population. *Dusts hands,* done.

    It was harder when the choice was between two ostensible Cold Warriors. In the Vice article’s 1961-3 context, that election was Nixon / Kennedy.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 26th, 2015 at 10:08 pm Reply | Quote
  • Zimriel Says:

    “[Rockwell] had exerted himself—and destroyed his family and finances—to become a national pariah, sinking from a decorated Navy officer to a delusional Nazi commander in just six years.”

    I am reminded of Revilo P. Oliver.

    The man was a genius; a scholar of Sanskrit for heavensakes. (Not unlike the classicist Enoch Powell.) RadishMag pointed me to Oliver’s right-wing advocacy output, so I read some of it. It’s… wretched. Incoherent hate for the most part. (And, here, *completely* unlike Powell.)

    At least Kevin MacDonald’s “Culture of Critique” documented everything and made an argument. It demands to be taken seriously; even if only to rebut it (like Derbyshire did in “The Marx of the Antisemites”). Oliver’s sloppiness, and abusive prose style, makes it harder to take his work seriously.

    Hate makes people stupid. This might even be a medical fact. A chimp confronted by (what he thinks is) a hungry leopard doesn’t have time to reason things out, after all.

    [Reply]

    OldStudent Reply:

    “Hate makes people stupid.”
    Wow.
    Better watch out, Zimriel.
    The anointed Word in Nrx land is that Hate is Good and seeing how they are recruiting to appoint new Inquisitors, you
    Are a Traitor!! A heretic.
    Too much of that SJW-speak and 80% of your comrades would have you burned.

    [Reply]

    Exfernal Reply:

    The anointed Word in Nrx land is that Hate is Good
    A link or quote, please?

    [Reply]

    SanguineEmpiricist Reply:

    Want to expand your Burnham/Dante opinion or maybe write it on your website?

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 27th, 2015 at 12:20 am Reply | Quote
  • Kwisatz Haderach Says:

    Charles Murray is going dark. http://www.cato.org/multimedia/daily-podcast/lets-render-some-federal-codes-unenforceable

    He wants to make federal regulatory fines an insurable, like a fire or flood. Or, put another way, he’s interpreted America as damage and wants to route around it.

    [Reply]

    Kgaard Reply:

    Good stuff. Just listened to it. I feel a trend here. Mickelthwait’s “The Fourth Revolution: The Global Race to Reinvent the State” covers much of the same ground but with a somewhat more optimistic bent: He argues that because government has lagged so badly in modernization it is now directly in the crosshairs of the citizenry and it’s gonna get sliced and diced and squeezed down to size just via popular fury.

    http://www.amazon.com/Fourth-Revolution-Global-Reinvent-State/dp/1594205396/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1430151908&sr=1-1&keywords=the+fourth+revolution

    Guys like Scott Walker have proven slashing government can be a winning campaign platform. Murray is more bearish, arguing that it’s impossible to reform government via the ballot box.

    But maybe Murray is s too pessimistic. I mean … the technology is there to make government more efficient. It’s just been lagging in implementation. Any halfway decent Republican should be able to make this kind of thing happen. It’s low hanging fruit. In the same way Jews have given up on immigrants, Democrats may throw state workers under the bus (they’ve done it with teachers unions in some cases).

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 27th, 2015 at 11:15 am Reply | Quote
  • SVErshov Says:

    @Exfernal it is like asking which gun is better. Best gun is those which you have with you, when you need it.

    [Reply]

    Exfernal Reply:

    I disagree. See: Monsanto and GM crops that require constant resupply of seeds from the monopolist.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 27th, 2015 at 12:09 pm Reply | Quote
  • scientism Says:

    Nick Bostrom’s TED talk on super-intelligence.

    http://www.ted.com/talks/nick_bostrom_what_happens_when_our_computers_get_smarter_than_we_are

    [Reply]

    Kgaard Reply:

    Interesting talk but I’m not sure how far it advanced the ball. 2040 is a long time from now. I would like to see someone lay out a time line for the steps toward artificial intelligence that are gonna happen between now and then.

    I can think of a few that seem critical:

    * Speech recognition technology that understands how REAL PEOPLE talk.
    * Same technology, but able to then formulate coherent replies.
    * Start down this road until it gets better and better.

    I’ve been presuming that commercializable VR will create a growing demand for precisely this kind of technology, so that the virtual people in VR games and movies can act more intelligently. If the whole point of VR is that the user can interact spatially with the “people” inside the virtual world, it would seem to naturally follow that customers will demand more human-like responses from those VR people.

    Example: In a VR game I go up and tap a VR person on the shoulder. That person turns around. I say ‘Hi.” I am gonna want that person to say “hi” back. This is a demand I would not make of a regular 2D video game (much less a movie) but it’s a logical demand for a VR game.

    How hard is this? And how hard is Silicon Valley hammering on this problem?

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 27th, 2015 at 7:03 pm Reply | Quote
  • n/a Says:

    @zimriel

    As I recall, Derbyshire started off his “rebuttal” of MacDonald by explaining how he’d discovered that “getting the Jew thing” is bad for one’s career and that therefore he’d resolved not to “get it”. Now that he has less of a career to worry about, he seems to have less trouble getting it (linked by Nick Land above):

    “4.Not Good for the Jews. I don’t think it’s controversial to say that in bringing about big cultural changes in our country, Jewish elites in the media, arts, show business, and the intelligentsia have immensely disproportionate influence.

    For complex historical and cultural reasons written up by Kevin MacDonald and others, American Jews have been energetic proponents of multiculturalism and white race guilt.”

    https://www.vdare.com/articles/john-derbyshire-the-american-political-system-can-solve-the-race-problem-for-a-given-meaning-of-solve

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    I suspect the Derb wants to demonstrate that it’s possible to face some obvious facts without going completely out of your mind.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 28th, 2015 at 5:27 am Reply | Quote
  • n/a Says:

    Nick,

    “obvious facts”

    I’m glad we’re on the same page now.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 28th, 2015 at 10:17 am Reply | Quote
  • Chris B Says:

    Any chance of sparking a discussion on this area ?

    http://athousandnations.com/2015/04/03/the-nakamoto-consensus%E2%80%8A-%E2%80%8Ahow-we-end-bad-governance/

    http://mitrailleuse.net/2015/04/04/the-analog-option/

    http://www.newinternationaloutlook.com/2015/04/26/chaos-beasts/

    I know it might be a bit out of the NRx area of concern, but I figure it might be an interesting break from banging on about merging “teh trike” , talking about how racist we should be, and blathering on about someone being mean to a girl.

    [Reply]

    Peter A. Taylor Reply:

    I see your Mike Gibson and I raise you a Nick Szabo.

    “If politics could be deduced this might be called the Central Theorem of Politics — we can’t properly respond to a global initiation of force without local initiations of force.”

    http://unenumerated.blogspot.com/2007/05/why-legal-procedure-is-central-to.html

    [Reply]

    Chris B Reply:

    Prefer to stick with the question of can sovereignty be decoupled from geographic locality and be de-territorialised as asserted by the Gibson post, or if this is a woeful misunderstanding of what is going to happen. A good pre-run of this in my opinion is the development of the internet which has gone from being an anarchist wonderland threatening the death of nations – to a tool of control never before seen.

    The common law question is another meaty one that needs discussing eventually. MM is very opposed, and I can understand his reasoning. Common law is not clear, and not really very compatible with formalism, and is an open door to quasi judicial dictatorship as seen in the USA. In fact, I am beginning to think MM’s stuff is not very “post libertarian” at all.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    So why do the Atlanteans — even in the depths of their utter decadence — still dominate the earth, while the Hyperboreans sulk, and fail?

    Whoever conducts catallaxy at its greatest intensity rules.

    scientism Reply:

    @ admin

    You still need a whoever to conduct it. Isn’t that point? The blockchain is another tool in the toolbox of the capable sovereign; a challenge to a lame duck sovereignty, rather than a challenge to sovereignty itself.

    vimothy Reply:

    Admin:

    So why do the Atlanteans — even in the depths of their utter decadence — still dominate the earth, while the Hyperboreans sulk, and fail?

    Whoever conducts catallaxy at its greatest intensity rules.

    Mencius Moldbug:

    You simply can’t use military or even cultural conquest as a proof of institutional superiority. Alaric sacked Rome – did that make Gothic institutions superior to Roman institutions? This means of reasoning will lead you into the most absurd Panglossian paradoxes.

    We live in an Anglo-American world because Nelson tacked left instead of right at Trafalgar, or whatever. History is contingent – it is not a matter of destiny. (It’s actually no accident that your American-leadership line is reminiscent of the old Manifest Destiny movement; it is more or less the modern successor of that movement, I believe.)

    I find an excellent cure for this particular disorder – American and/or democratic triumphalism – is Henry Maine’s Essays on Popular Government (1893). The accuracy of Maine’s predictions will shock you. Even the features he praises in the US Constitution were to be removed in a generation, with the exact results he would have predicted.

    http://rajivsethi.blogspot.com/2009/11/william-dudley-and-hyman-minsky-on.html?showComment=1259714145255#c5769594377146137253

    an inanimate aluminum tube Reply:

    “So why do the Atlanteans — even in the depths of their utter decadence — still dominate the earth, while the Hyperboreans sulk, and fail?”

    I would be careful about drawing too many conclusions from such a limited data set.

    It’s not very intellectual to say so, but the fact is that the Atlanteans had a run of good luck.

    They found a huge, sparsely populated, unspoiled, resource rich continent with natives that had evolved to be very bad at resisting Western diseases.

    So the Atlanteans got to colonize that gigantic land mass, fill it up with their kind of people and unify it politically under the system of their choosing.

    That’s an incredible advantage that is likely to outweigh any number of small advantages, like plus or minus 10% to economic efficiency.

    Any group with decent cognitive ability that got control of North America was liable to end up in a pretty powerful position. Admittedly, Atlantean traits put them in the position to discover whatever was out there.

    But the Atlanteans proceeded to needlessly and pointlessly give that vast continent away within only about 300 years. Makes them seem kind of overrated, really.

    Chris B Reply:

    * for example picture a man standing in the middle of Baltimore declaring he is a citizen of Blockchainistan and is only bound by the laws of blockchainistan. I’m sure the local savages stealing his wallet will really care. Some citizenship.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    The idea that any such individual would be standing in the middle of Baltimore is a self-subverting absurdity.

    Chris B Reply:

    I can envision blockchain style governance being utilised by a territory, but the territory would need to be ultimately bordered. Within this border, someone will be sovereign. This sovereign will only be constrained by the laws in as much as they choose to be. I don’t see how blockchain contracts between A and B nullifies Zs ownership of the ground they stand on.

    [Reply]

    Posted on April 29th, 2015 at 3:40 am Reply | Quote

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