Frankenstein

Frankentein00

This comment thread makes it vividly clear what’s at stake in the Cathedral vs. Alt-Right grudge match. It’s Frankenstein against his monster.

(No way China doesn’t end up inheriting everything, on current Occidental degeneration trends.)

Moldbug on Breivik, cutting to the core of the right-wing activist delusion:

A restoration of traditional, pre-liberal or even pre-Christian Norway is a herculean task of social and political engineering. It cannot possibly be carried on without absolute sovereignty. Indeed, the task of eradicating liberal institutions and liberal culture in Norway, though tremendous (and itself requiring absolute sovereignty), pales before the much more difficult task of recreating a genuine Norwegian society that isn’t a ridiculous theme-park joke. […] The idea that any incremental political change, achieved by any sort of “activism” (from mass whining to mass murder), can advance this project in any way at all, is inherently retarded.

Of course, very few are capable of doing anything positively valuable, such as inventing a new crypto-currency, or advancing some other practical Exit technology, so the temptation is to do something retarded instead. “Something needs to be done, and this is something.” Also, they’re increasingly desperate, poor creatures.

(Humans are probably too stupid to live.)

June 18, 2016admin 136 Comments »
FILED UNDER :Collapse

TAGGED WITH : , , ,

136 Responses to this entry

  • Cryptogenic Says:

    It takes a particular cast of mind and a very low time preference to maintain the kind of iciness that is the mark of NRx, and that drew me to these colder zones to begin with. Not everyone has the amygdala for it.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    Had we but World enough, and Time,
    This coyness Lady were no crime.
    We would sit down, and think which way
    To walk, and pass our long Loves Day.
    Thou by the Indian Ganges side.
    Should’st Rubies find: I by the Tide
    Of Humber would complain. I would
    Love you ten years before the Flood:
    And you should if you please refuse
    Till the Conversion of the Jews.

    [Reply]

    Cryptogenic Reply:

    It’s not coyness. It’s non-Leftism.

    [Reply]

    Cryptogenic Reply:

    Actually, it’s not merely non-Leftism, it’s basic fucking hygiene.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    I think you would be happier at NRO they’re really into respectability while being vaguely not left sort of.

    [Reply]

    Cryptogenic Reply:

    You’re so Boolean. I think you’d be happier in a mosque.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    Good one but Honestly I muh truth falls somewhere between the two sides of this argument. I think there was a third between the strormfront and Land position until recently which should have been maintained by all parties. as well as the no enemies on the right treaty. Personally I find certain aspects of both sides pretty fucking shall we say frustrating.I find both sides toying with leftist ideas scary, the alt reich socialist is retarded in a european state even the dumbest will be have enough financial security and dignity to form a family without the need for jewish redistribution schemes. Denrx really needs to get out of the clouds and admit a return to westciv nations being run by and for europeans is the foundation of any reaction and that spending decades blogging about BTC AI Robotics and far fetched political economic models whiles a quarter of a million assorted niggers pour across western borders every month and the cathedral ramps up its ability to shut down voice and exit is like nero fiddling while rome burned.Its not that these ideas are not important and may not indeed cause major disruption in a decade or two, its we may not survive as a people that long. I build things often Im frustrated because I have to alter an existing structure while keeping it running this causes compromises in the ideal design and it can cause work to be done that is only temporary but thats the job. Its more fun to imagine the ideal design but thats not the job. Another problem I have is land sometimes sounds an awful lot like he really just wants to switch places with Soros and Clinton that he has equal contempt for the commoner and equally exotic and unproven ideas about social engineering.The retort is always MM said it so there. I really liked MM but hes not infallible certainly he ought to be tested and questioned but i see no serious engagement with counter argument against aspects particularly passivity and political engagement. MM foresaw neoreaction would lead to hitler and being jewish and hitler having lost he tried to find work arounds I want an ethno state I dont want hitler or socialism or fascism,But i see no evidense the average white wants them the commies had to make common cause with every deviant and degenerate imaginable and import tens of millions of mental defective niggers to sell redistributism whites simply want to be able to raise families in peace. The problem with democracy is not the mobs of whites will demand free shit or demand hitler, they had to create the Cathedral to brain wash then into that and still have to rely on riggers fags and single moms and the threat of nazis. which means engaging in politics as a means to an end is not the risk per se the problem of democracy MM wonderfully critiqued is the moral hazard it poses not to the masses but to the elites. This is a completely different problem to solve. Even MM says in order to solve it one must seize power. The left has stupidly handed us the gun. They have revealed their hand too soon out of hubris and made clear that they intend to oppress whites to make them a minority in their own lands and allow niggers to rape and kill them and to redistribute their wealth and humiliate them. Since there is no danger from proles using their righteous reaction to this to seize power only presents the problem of the commies in power and the nazis who will likely be in on the coup this really oughtn’t be so hard to figure out, certainly compared to reinventing civilization from scratch and instituting your new invention its a piece of cake. hell even Hitler figured that out. BTW MM says Hitler was an example of right wing activism and violence that worked. Once you have power you can play reaction all you want if you dont fuck things up [which mm also warns you better be ready cause you only got one shot] then no one will challenge you. But DENRX is not remotely ready with any concrete plan policies for administering a state but has lots of ideas about robots and bitcoin.This revenge of the nerd faggotry is depressing because your minds could be put to better use. i have noticed my entire life thast people over 130 are pretty useless in the real world they are best used like tools of people between 120 and 130 obviously theres exceptions. Point being egg heads may not be best weapon against egg heads.

    [Reply]

    R. J. Moore II Reply:

    A major reason 130+ IQ people have problems is the prevalence of people too stupid for them to talk to. Eliminate the underclass, you eliminate the largest threat to the Autist elite.

    R. J. Moore II Reply:

    Moreover, people of 100 IQ are pretty fucking stupid and normie psychology is incredibly gullible. This is bad juju for a contract-based capitalist society, these people can not be allowed in them.

    R. J. Moore II Reply:

    A natural misanthropy definitely helps. I don’t even care what happens to the masses, wish they’d all kill each other in some manner that didn’t inconvenience me as much as their living does.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 1:49 pm Reply | Quote
  • Rasputin Says:

    Spot on (obviously).

    It’s thoroughly depressing to see so many deluded comments in the previous thread by people either ignorant of (or incapable of grasping) Moldbug’s basic insights on rightwing activism. They seem to think that the Left and the Right advance in the same way, that the tactics of the former can be cross applied to the latter, and envisage symmetry where there is only asymmetry.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    PROVE IT because every change of power Im aware of came out of violence. Every powe Im aware of maintains it through threat of violence. Its one thing to say when the opposition controls the media frame its hard to make violence work for you, its harder to use violence to convince those in favor of order than those in favor of disorder. Its another to hide behind MMs skirts to avoid manning up when your people and civilization are being destroyed at the pace they are post moldbug. Its also important to think tactically about time decay, anything that would buy even a year is worth pursuing. MMs talent was explaing to leftys why they were stupid for thinking that way, something non leftys have known for centuries.
    Some of you seem to think you are simply going to be able to re institute a cognitive jim crow that will just happen to hurt minorities more but even though they will be the majority by the time you AI robotic king ascends the throne they will simply accept this. Its absurd you cant even maintain order in cities now the minorities have to be pushed out as a baseline for civilization. Only now is that still possible without massive blood shed. Once that was done the chances of MMs ideas become a lot more plausible to institute.

    [Reply]

    Rasputin Reply:

    Yes, historically most changes in power may have come out of violence – but which side won? The more powerful one. Since the Left is vastly more powerful than the Right, our best strategy is to remain in the shadows and continue our analysis of it, while trying to shift the opinions of elites on key matters in a direction more favourable to us, while the best of us build things which offer opportunities for fragmentation and Exit, and/or undermine the monopoly on bestowing status currently maintained by the Left.

    You, on the other hand, seem to be spoiling for a fight you are inevitably going lose. IMHO that is retarded.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    really what have you developed to facilitate secession or exit ? what youre really saying is youre scared and you want to have overwhelming advantage before letting others risk for you. Theres nothing wrong with converting elites and thinking tech but theres is no time to think they are the answer no ones suggesting chucking bombs indiscriminately rather thinking about overthrowing the cathedral with any means that will work seriously dislodging them in a decade at most and tying them in knots until them they do not have the power you think they are hated by all a smart person could make that work

    admin Reply:

    “before letting others risk for you” — before letting others stab an unarmed woman to death in the street while shouting Alt-Right football slogans.

    aristocalypse Reply:

    I´d have blocked this “michael” person in an instant.

    [Reply]

    holipopiloh Reply:

    Another meaningless yelp from yet another “confused” liberal No one is denying the existence of the asymmetry. We know what is causing it.

    (Now I understand why Reactionary Future always comes across as so frustrated.)

    [Reply]

    Edenist whackjob Reply:

    Maybe one could say that the Right is pro-negentropy whereas the Left is pro-entropy. This would then mean that Right tactics are fundamentally about allowing richer and more structured patterns to form, and that Left tactics are about heading toward heat death.

    Or maybe that’s too esoteric…?

    [Reply]

    vxxc2014 Reply:

    Moldbug is a coward. That’s why he rules out activism and violence. He said so himself. He’s also no prophet for he has only critiqued current Progressive culture. 100 years ago he would have been a communist as were his grandparents and he also said that himself.
    He was raised a Progressive and awoke in his 20s to discover Darth Vader was his Grandfather. He really is Ren incarnate.

    As for NRx mocking Leftist derived analysis and models the irony abounds.

    [Reply]

    R. J. Moore II Reply:

    I tend to agree that MM and many NRx are basically liberal nerds that are afraid of fighting. Brains + brawn, contra Hollyjude, are not antithetical in IRL good breeding stock. Aryans: high IQ WARLORD

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    yeah he also basically said Hitler did it very successfully but Hitler is hard to control as a jew i can understand how that might be a non starter doesnt mean it isnt a possibility. But you know every time i read one of these type threads i go back and read his writings on the subject and I never come away convinced it wont work or hasnt worked and hes a convincing guy. His cautions about getting populist violence leading to getting sucked back into leftism via democracy is more convincing than his assertion right wing violence doesnt work. I also really dont see the democracy problem as mobs of white guys wanting free stuff I see it more as mobs of elites wanting to be recognized. In a country the size of USG i can find plenty of useful work for cog elites without letting them mess with the controls of state. the cathedral allows illusion of democracy which might even be genetic with euros while still allowing rulers to do as they think best. The problem is they are stuck on a stupid idea and cant let it go.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 1:53 pm Reply | Quote
  • Anon Says:

    It’s funny how you arrogant NRx people think you created something, or originated something, or are even relevant.
    The cancerous “Alt-Right” came about from the revival of Nationalist Movements, and can be traced as far back as Rockwell, Mosley and W.L. Pierce – they, of course, were inspired by the Fascists and Traditionalist Writters, Romantics and others.
    Only now, with the miracle of the Internet that those mentioned gained a plataform worth of their sayings, intead of the lying Jewish press, and could reach people from everywhere.
    So, in short:
    NRx – Irrelevant.
    Nationalists – The New Movement, the New Right, the Future
    Alt-Right – A bunch of pseudos.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    O brave new world,
    That has such people in ‘t!

    [Reply]

    anon Reply:

    In the play named The Tempest, you’ve got a young woman named Miranda, who has been on an island her entire life, with only her father and two little spirits. She’s basically never seen a man that’s a good contender for a romance. Then, a ship comes up on shore with lots of men. She spots one of the men, Ferdinand, and gets all excited. But this line, the “brave new world” line, comes at the end of the novel, when she finally sees all the other men. As you can imagine, there’s a lot of sexuality beneath the surface here, as there is in the later Huxley work (the main character of which is a riff on Miranda). It’s a line said by a gentle, girlish soul, hailing from an uneventful, virtuous, but stagnant place, upon seeing something bold, new, frightening and Faustian which might move and ravish her sensibilities.

    *drops mike*

    [Reply]

    Edenist whackjob Reply:

    The NRx ethos, its myth if you will, is fundamentally about the lone genius who through magic manages to escape the Inevitable Truth which he is facing. It’s about being some kind of Kafka-Faust and getting away with reason through superior technology.

    So if, NRx succeeds, it will come completely out of life hack. It will be the Mule character who invents some new technology which makes philosophizing obsolete.

    The end of history, delivered as a life-hack. Oh yes…

    [Reply]

    Edenist whackjob Reply:

    *completely out of left field

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    no its spot on DENRx as land and some others imagine it conserves nothing its another elite utopian experiment

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 1:53 pm Reply | Quote
  • michael Says:

    MM isnt god He was a better critic than social engineer,Their are a couple of problems to your way. First there simply isnt time. There may only be time to die like men, but that would be better than nothing; better than watching trembling in a corner of asia, or San Francisco. Anything that bought western civilization time is worth trying. Hillary will be even more effective than the gay mullatto within a year and a half you can start to kiss goodbye free speech, guns, and anything else that

    The other is the suggestions post moldbug get more bizarre every year. The problem is eloi Elites infected with communism/multiculturalism, which is some weird intellectual plan to reorder humans and their societies. DENRx is sounding more and more like some rival eloi elites with an even more weird plan to try yet another total reinvention of human society. Even if you actually invented the killer app to defeat the cathedral its really not clear what you plan to do and except experiment with bizarre unproven ideas you claim MM proved, except no one agrees what he even meant except in some broad terms about power and democracy. Thats not conservatism thats progressivism. You ignore blaring facts tha dont align with MM etal. prole whites are not natural communists they have been carefully manipulated in what support they give the cathedral more through fear than avarice.Democracys problems is not the empowering of white mobs, its elites much like yourselves. I dont say this meanly I am probably also a dreamer. Admittedly some altright is pretty much neo nazi and may as you said yesterday serve the enemy, I thought this when Timmothy McVeigh bombed the federal building. ABB could indeed incite a new martyrdom signaling or it might do what islamic terrorism does stop the signaling.All those things are minor minor points about possible tactics.
    The big point is the alt right recognizes the time decay much better than the DENRx, The alt right has simpler more proven strategy. Just roll back the clock to a more civilized period in west civ history. They rightly see the bedrock is whiteness where french etc ness is not possible. They understand without minority underclass [the weight of the poor] the marxists lose their entire arsenal, And life in the west becomes pleasant its gets wealthy again it can think straight again it can assert its true interests again. They also understand using ethnic solidarity is a proven tactic to mobilize the force needed to take over the cathedral apparatus, possibly non violently [more or less].Violence or the threat of violence is ALWAYS HOW power is transferred violence is the essence of power.While its fun to imagine all us jr Galts going on strike it simply aint going to happen. I dont want to live in the fourth reich but Id rather live there than here. what I think is DENRx shouild come back down to earth get over your cathedralist classist distaste for “racism’ and admit the basis of western civilization is western people not as many smart niggers or Japanese robots as you can shoe horn in to gattaca. You worry about alt right entry why dont you enter the alt right and temper it give it better strategies and think about realistic paths to stopping the demographic obliteration of the west taking power and what practical non experimental idea you could put in place to stop a replay of the last 100 years.By all means continue to think about things like crpto currency and AI robotics and libertarian cities these will indeed have big impacts in 50 years if we live that long

    [Reply]

    Aristocles Invictvs Reply:

    I always enjoy your comments but could you please learn how to put spaces between paragraphs, and punctuate correctly.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    would you believe that was me trying. Im pretty much completely uneducated

    [Reply]

    Alrenous Reply:

    Put a carriage return after every period. It won’t be great but it will be a step up.

    Tentative Joiner Reply:

    I suggest two carriage returns whether it’s after every period or not so that the paragraphs do not stick together. I.e., compare

    Paragraph one. Quisque volutpat condimentum velit. Class aptent taciti sociosqu ad litora torquent per conubia nostra, per inceptos himenaeos.
    Paragraph two. Vestibulum ante ipsum primis in faucibus orci luctus et ultrices posuere cubilia Curae; Morbi lacinia molestie dui. Praesent blandit dolor. Sed non quam. In vel mi sit amet augue congue elementum. Morbi in ipsum sit amet pede facilisis laoreet.

    and

    Paragraph one. Quisque volutpat condimentum velit. Class aptent taciti sociosqu ad litora torquent per conubia nostra, per inceptos himenaeos.

    Paragraph two. Vestibulum ante ipsum primis in faucibus orci luctus et ultrices posuere cubilia Curae; Morbi lacinia molestie dui. Praesent blandit dolor. Sed non quam. In vel mi sit amet augue congue elementum. Morbi in ipsum sit amet pede facilisis laoreet.

    vxxc2014 Reply:

    Excellent Michael.

    Practical suggestions. Unfortunately it’s hard work to temper the alt right and if the word work never mind hard is put in front of these people that’s the threshold never to cross.

    Never mind risk. Oh no.

    [Reply]

    SanguineEmpiricist Reply:

    i love this one. you’re the one who advocated christianity to latin american women because they think god is really hot right?

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 2:11 pm Reply | Quote
  • anon Says:

    It’s ironic that you link to that Mencius article about ABB, Nick.

    Don’t you realize that the article is saying that the definition of whether political murder is legitimate or not, is whether it helps or harms the political cause it champions?

    So, if this murder appears to not hurt in the polls, aren’t you forced to admit that your reaction was wrong?

    [Reply]

    Hattori Reply:

    It may not hurt this time but the undeniable tendency of these chimpouts is that they do hurt the right almost every time.

    Not really surprised with anything from the altright since I heard Spencer say he wanted to keep the EU and turn it into the new roman empire.

    [Reply]

    Hattori Reply:

    Not to say that I shed tears for these lefty politicians biting the dust. Like Vox Day says the only surprising thing here is that pro immigration politicians haven’t been victims of these more often.

    [Reply]

    Johan Schmidt Reply:

    “It may not hurt this time but the undeniable tendency of these chimpouts is that they do hurt the right almost every time.”

    The assassinations of Yitzhak Rabin and Inejiro Asanuma didn’t seem to do too much harm.

    [Reply]

    anon Reply:

    “It may not hurt this time but the undeniable tendency of these chimpouts is that they do hurt the right almost every time.”

    That’s not true. Some murders help, some murders harm. But it’s beside the point. You and I and Nick Land have zero power to prevent lone nuts from doing murder.

    What we do have control over, however, is how we react, ourselves.

    Nick Land is reacting by encouraging everyone to raise their right hand and say that they don’t have cooties like the mentally ill shooter, shortly after Barack Obama reacts to BLM by calling it “understandable frustration”. The commentariat disagrees with Land that this cringing self-debasement is very clever, or very likely to help legitimize himself or the Right generally. It accomplishes nothing, and if anything, it legitimizes the Left as a moral arbiter.

    Contaminated NEET Reply:

    Well said, anon! I’ve been thinking about exactly what my disagreement with admin on this issue is, and you just explained it far better than I could, even to myself. Thank you.

    vxxc2014 Reply:

    What Chimp-out is hurting the right?

    *crickets*

    It might be eroding your credibility as a passivist hanging out on Prog sites…meanwhile in the real world Chimps are still better men than cowards.

    Really NRx could learn basic lessons by studying Chimps. Chimps are an evolutionary winner, we got here by fighting better and making better weapons than Chimps.

    [Reply]

    Hattori Reply:

    The newest polls:

    U.K. POLL ON EU SHOWS 44% LEAVE, 42% REMAIN: YOUGOV/ITV U.K. SURVATION POLL ON EU SHOWS REMAIN 45%, LEAVE 42%

    This after multiple weeks of steady leave advantage.
    Clearly the desired effect lol.

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 2:20 pm Reply | Quote
  • holipopiloh Says:

    That lousy thread was bad enough, but with this follow-up it’s becoming increasingly clear that the only reason why you are in this politico-philosophical corner in the first place is to piss inside the tent.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    its half troll dont be to hard on him he posts just as many JQ things.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 3:04 pm Reply | Quote
  • Chris B Says:

    This is a joke. This is a complete butchering of what Moldbug wrote.

    [Reply]

    anon Reply:

    Nick’s jimmies have been rustled by the comment section. Nick does not enjoy the cut and thrust of debate with the commentariat. 90% of the comments dissent against him, and 90% of those are left alone in disgust. Apparently, a popular nationalism willing to cheer the death of a leftie politician is a “monster”! Very amusing, considering the other subject matters of the blog, and of Mencius Moldbug.

    In the hashtags of the above post, Nick displays how he truly feels about normal people from the civilization which birthed him. Permit me to quote from Nick Land’s spiritual brother, Kevin Williamson:

    “The truth about these dysfunctional, downscale communities is that they deserve to die. Economically, they are negative assets. Morally, they are indefensible. Forget all your cheap theatrical Bruce Springsteen crap. Forget your sanctimony about struggling Rust Belt factory towns and your conspiracy theories about the wily Orientals stealing our jobs. Forget your goddamned gypsum, and, if he has a problem with that, forget Ed Burke, too. The white American underclass is in thrall to a vicious, selfish culture whose main products are misery and used heroin needles. Donald Trump’s speeches make them feel good. So does OxyContin. What they need isn’t analgesics, literal or political. They need real opportunity, which means that they need real change, which means that they need U-Haul.”
    http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/432796/working-class-whites-have-moral-responsibilities-defense-kevin-williamson

    Kevin Williamson and Nick Land both have no biological children.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    What irks me more than the anti white anti human attitude is the total inability to take responsibility as one of the self declared elites for a lack of leadership. Prole whites hell even prole blacks could be orders of magnitude better but for elite dereliction. And they seem to think they can transcend their inferiors as if once they have partitioned off the upper decile the same problems of variance wont again rear up.

    [Reply]

    smg Reply:

    Really perceptive comment.

    R. J. Moore II Reply:

    There are qualitative differences between smart people and normies. In fact, stupid people are the main problem, getting rid of them even assuming normal IQ otherwise would dramatically change society

    Cryptogenic Reply:

    There’s a lot of pentup anti-Landism coming out in a sudden rush. Tell us how you really feel, effusive romantics.

    “Muh children”? Really? Full retard.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    There is a correlation between being a parent being married [being an adult] and conservatism. Most parents will report a change of mind perspective. So yeah MUH Children whats more conservative than that. teh children is meme,muh children is reality.

    [Reply]

    R. J. Moore II Reply:

    I think it’s funny how the breeder signalling ignores the vast importance of celibate priests to the entirety of Western Civilization since the Vestal Virgins. I’m certainly not a conservative,

    R. J. Moore II Reply:

    ctd. I’m a radical.
    Not that I’m an anti-natalist, I just think MOST people shouldn’t have children (though unfortunately many of the least do).

    Anon Reply:

    “There’s a lot of pentup anti-Landism coming out in a sudden rush. .”

    Confirmed for being to new to NRx. It’s like you didn’t even browse the /duck/ or /aristoi/ infodumps on Land and his motivations.

    [Reply]

    Mark Warburton Reply:

    I never understood the feigned neutrality of the tripartite. It’s only now that Nick has been clearer on what Neoreaction from a tech comm perspective is, that the alt right humanists are sharpening their knives and donning the jack boots.

    Vladimir and Goulding were concerned there would be entryism from lower IQed people…that’s one of the reasons they left. This was essentially always a n intellectual venture, and for ethnic nationalists to be calling for praxis after Jo Cox’s murder. Well. You know Nick and co will look down at you for that. I have no idea why this continues…

    Nick stop making posts that taunt these people! nothing productive comes from it,however you try to polish the turd.
    p

    [Reply]

    wu-wei Reply:

    Nick stop making posts that taunt these people! nothing productive comes from it,however you try to polish the turd.

    If nothing else, it is endlessly entertaining, however.

    [Reply]

    Xoth Reply:

    The old school NRx brahmins, peace be upon them, unfortunately lack the skill or inclination to even build up a holiness spiral of neo-reactionary virtue signalling. For starters, you simply can’t do that by earnestly signalling for the other side.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    It’s mutually-beneficial boundary-setting.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 3:05 pm Reply | Quote
  • Brett Stevens Says:

    The idea that any incremental political change, achieved by any sort of “activism” (from mass whining to mass murder), can advance this project in any way at all, is inherently retarded.

    This is why many of us are monarchists: no System can do what requires smart, exceptional people to do.

    But, I do not see this as radical, but rather the un-doing of Leftist radicalism. De-radicalizing requires a firm hand to rip out the roots of the infestation and rebuild institutions.

    That, and of course to repatriate the Other and exile the homegrown insane.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    Could we exile the homegrown insane to the same place as the others and install video cameras?Id subscribe to the Quentin Tarantino channel

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 3:13 pm Reply | Quote
  • NRK Says:

    All claims that “NRx is not french” aside, Marine Le Pen’s pacified FN appears to fall outside of that struggle between two insanities you describe. Even if I find little agreement with them, in it’s present form it is much less monstrous than the french branch of the cathedral is frankensteinian. Could it be that after all, anglos have something to learn from the french, politically no less?

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 3:44 pm Reply | Quote
  • spandrell Says:

    These are relevant

    https://bloodyshovel.wordpress.com/2015/11/21/north-korea/

    https://bloodyshovel.wordpress.com/2016/04/25/reaction-and-the-bullshit-industry/

    By the way most Chinese people I know, in the West and in China, would make the alt-right look like BLM activists.

    It’s an awkward time to be an expat.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 4:27 pm Reply | Quote
  • Seth Largo Says:

    The comments claiming that Islam is on the ascendant “because violence” were among the most confused. I think Spengler has this right. The violence in the Middle East is a symptom of serious decline, not ascendancy.

    [Reply]

    holipopiloh Reply:

    No offence, but your reading comprehension is rather poor. The claim being made was that Islamic protrusion is beneficial to certain power factions, so they encourage it. The violence is the Middle East is business as usual.

    [Reply]

    Seth Largo Reply:

    lol wut

    Islam seems to encourage their own crazy people to go in murder frenzies and yet Islam’s power has been growing for decades.

    So violence doesn’t seem to matter that much, does it?

    A sustained campaign of targeted violence is only disadventageous if you are eventually defeated. Otherivvise it is closely linked to political success.

    Brussels, Sweden, Germany. World census data. Islam is spreading at the fastest pace in history, dude. And all of their success is due to uninhibited aggression.

    [Reply]

    holipopiloh Reply:

    You really do suck at following the train of thought in a discussion…

    /facepalm

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 5:57 pm Reply | Quote
  • frank Says:

    I’m not convinced that Moldbug’s critique applies in this situation.

    (1) (Even the smarter contingent of) Alt-right doesn’t have an agenda of full restoration. They basically want 4th reich. From this point of view, although they would advise against it, right-wing lumpen-incontinence is a real practical tool.

    (1a) Right-wing coups throughout the second half of the 20th century have successfully used left and right incontinence to their advantage. The formula is simple: when the nation approaches a left vs right civili war (which is the logical conclusion of democracy) give it a tacit push and people will start begging for a strongman to take over. The military coup of 1980 in Turkey, for instance, had a whopping 92% approval rate.

    Granted, those coups were all NATO supported against the USSR funded left. Who would support or antagonize a possible right-wing coup in western countries of the current year? Cathedral is weak. It is at least doubtful that the state department would militarily antagonize a right-wing military coup that happened in a chaotic, say, France. Cathedral mind-control machine doesn’t nearly have the same stranglehold on memes of production it used to have. On the other hand, you have Russia and China, who would clearly patronize anti-Cathedral coups. So there’s a very valid argument for the existence of realistic opportunities of a right-wing military coup made possible by incontinent violence on both sides. This is a possible path to 4th reich.

    (2) It is not clear that waiting for a restoration program (and its apolitical property update) is in the self-interest of the incontinent parts of the alt-right.

    (3) The contingent of the alt-right (Curt Doolittle’s propertarians for example) that think they’ll start a militia and force the state department to surrender through sheer military and strategic ingenuity are indeed suicidally delusional.

    (4) Frequenters of the reactosphere tend to be depressed. Lashing out is a natural strategy to escape depression. Going out in a blaze of glory doesn’t look so bad when you’re deeply depressed. Not to mention this might, indeed, be in their genetic interest.

    (5) In the fast approaching age of intense religio-memetic warfare, the scenario I describe in (1a) might become the norm in regions of the former Western Civilization.

    (6) All this, is not of too much relevance to exit-based right. Populist right will do what it does.

    [Reply]

    vxxc2014 Reply:

    Except that the Exit based Right doesn’t have an actual Exit.

    It doesn’t have anything but delusion.

    We however have nations we’ll defend.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    well in fairness they have video games, cuck porn, and moms basement.

    [Reply]

    vxxc2014 Reply:

    Thank you for being fair.

    frank Reply:

    Stones and glass houses. The right has been losing for centuries, so yes, none of us has anything — yet. But exit technologies are being engineered at unprecedented speeds. Very few people would not laugh at the idea that in less than a decade, non-government issued, non-inflationary, anonymous, decentralized money would be an actual thing.

    You follow your strategy, we’ll do our own thing. No hard feelings.

    Btw mike, last I checked, /pol/ was your thede. So, the joke’s on you.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    Not only am i laughing at bitcoin so is Yarvin, and BTW I have quite a lot Im a successful adult. I did the exit thing in 92 left the rodney king riots in my rear view and built my own little galts gulch in northern idaho hydro electric still electrolyzer the whole 9 yards well the niggers and cathedrals showing up Putin is fighting them off in russia as is china and islam theres no exit I wish there was sure i still dream of eastern europe and seasteading but its larping any exit not defended by ICBMs is going nowhere. and that goes for voice. Im well aware of the speculation about how disruptive some tech might be, I have been reading and enjoying DENRx thinking for 20 years MM didnt invent all thats attributed to him. There simply isnt time to hope they collapse and power falls into denrx hands somehow. you want a denrx world use ethnonationalism because thats whats available its the end game of cathedralism and they are reaching too soon or simply failing the chimps are screaching now is the time to set up.faggot blogging about scifi is not becoming worthy to rule the world its not even being an adult.

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 6:02 pm Reply | Quote
  • michael Says:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/06/17/americans-now-think-its-okay-to-say-what-they-really-think-about-race/?tid=hybrid_experimentrandom_2_na

    WAPO notices overton window shift actually seems unperturbed. The question is is their a correlative window of violence. The wapo asks at the end what caused the shift;
    If the recent surveys do reflect a shift in the politics of race, then it isn’t clear what caused the change.

    “Valentino points to a decline in civility in U.S. politics, a trend that began decades ago as the two major parties began to see each other as enemies rather than as friendly rivals. Perhaps back when politicians from different parties worked together more frequently on major legislation, they had to be careful not to alienate each other with incendiary language about race.

    Valentino also speculates that Obama’s presidency might be part of the explanation.”

    Of course the answer is left has gotten to the point where they can get away with, and need to, in order to progress, get more explicit. So The response is going to be more explicit and of course new media.The left is again resorting to threats and violence it makes sense the overton window of violence will also shift. Whats changed is expectation for official violence against thugs is low while hind brain thirst for justice is signaling, the penalty for challenging the alphas is high but schadenfreude is cheap.Things like emasculating the police and army and shipping niggers to westport is not going to help the left, they know this and hope to rip accelerate the new world order before a reaction can coalesce.Now would be the time to seize power everyone knows if it goes any longer it will be unimaginable bloody and hard to predict

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 6:14 pm Reply | Quote
  • wu-wei Says:

    The amount of friction created within these two threads is absolutely mind-boggling.

    On one hand, you have some commenters essentially cheering the murder of Cox.

    On the other, there are some commenters who have seemingly interpreted admins posts as denying that right-wing activism can ever be effective (which obviously would be quite contra-Moldbug). I don’t really get that, as it seems obvious to me that Admin was merely restating standard Moldbuggian boilerplate – that right-wing activism and violence is only advantageous when it produces desirable results (or otherwise positively influences a desirable power-center), which clearly this recent murder has not.

    As commenters have pointed out, this event doesn’t appear to have negatively effected the polls for Brexit (not that I’m sure it matters much either way), but regardless, the idea that random street killings by individual, unorganized, and crazed maniacs is an any way desirable (or necessarily defensible) seems completely insane. What a shit-show.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    I dont know I think this has been boiling for a few months maybe its been a year, Im not sure either side actually understands what the other is getting at and both are getting dug in.What used to be the more ethno side of DENRx has moved towards the neo nazis who picked up on and ran with some Denrx amusements The less ethno side is disturbed by this and the attention its engendered but still enjoys watching the riot. At the same time some of the less ethno Denrx are getting awfully esoteric and acting kind of faggy which wouldnt be so bad if the Cathedral hadnt accelerated at such breathtaking rate since moldbug. There isnt time to wait for an AI savior so pretending acknowledging that is just proof we are unworthy morons just sounds like really familiar elite eloi faggotry.What they ought to be doing is figuring out how to maintain a alt right alt reich differentiation while still maintaining no enemies to the right how to have a plan in place in the event ethno nationalist seize power in the west which is frankly the likeliest scenario outside of the ANC seizing power in the west. Neo Nazism is a healthier reaction than I need feminism because…The left is pushing the anti white meme hard and clear and I think way too soon, but they are a distributed system so cant always control flow. at the same time all sorts of other roosters are coming home from shit money to bill gates and co baby boom invading. There is a high liklihood a huge white populist revolt will happen soon and the left is not as secure as they seem to think. Now would be the time to have CONCRETE policies to be able to offer to the brownshirts if they seize power. But there is nothing but larping. And why shoulnt we cheer the murder of cox she needed killing you are going to have to kill enough of them to make them give up hope of Communism might as well get used to it. Its absurd to think davos is going to call yarvin up and ask him to take over, The point isnt that violence is wrong but that it is hard to control the violent making agreements in advance with the violent being sure they dont see you as an enemy is good.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 8:10 pm Reply | Quote
  • cyborg_nomade Says:

    indeed

    [Reply]

    4candles Reply:

    Alt-Right: ‘What do you mean vigilante street executions are always a bad idea?’
    NRx: ‘I don’t know what I was even thinking (I mean, I don’t even lift). Go on without me! Build your beautiful utopia. I hope your plans accelerate rapidly.’

    [Reply]

    cyborg_nomade Reply:

    more like ‘your exit plan is “reforming”? so weak it’s laughable”

    if you can carve an actual exit with an actual sovereignty, supported by actual, functional defense systems, fine tuned to the needs of those interested (British nationalists even), then you’re actually providing a resistance to leftist spiral into decay.

    otherwise it’s just violent whining

    [Reply]

    4candles Reply:

    Well sure, if you’re going to go all strategic on me! Though surely the response to this:

    “[T]hen you’re actually providing a resistance to leftist spiral into decay”

    Is: why resist? Understandable hysteria aside, there really is little to fear from Leftist craziness, provided you position yourself sensibly. Their decay is our friend. Strictly speaking, ‘we’ don’t have to go anywhere – everything comes to us.

    cyborg_nomade Reply:

    the destruction of order and the disgenic effects of progressive policies is going to fail them, and everything that doesn’t have a realm of its own. resistance here means exit (order subsisting amongst chaos), not confrontation.

    nonetheless, if your idea is not to fight leftism inside their sovereignty – and therefore not activism – then i don’t think we disagree at all.

    Asher Reply:

    “May your plans accelerate rapidly” is a great line. May I crib it off you

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 8:47 pm Reply | Quote
  • John Says:

    Does anyone else note the hypocrisy in a neoreaction blog having a comment section?

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    patriarch,

    Thanks! To me that’s exactly the difference between propaganda (communication designed to propagate ideas to an audience that is unaware of these ideas or hostile to them) and polemic (communication designed to elicit emotional responses in an audience already sympathetic to those ideas).

    Unless its audience is actually literally captive (in which case you are no propagandist, but a mere shill), propaganda cannot succeed unless it can entertain an audience which is at least neutral and probably hostile. It is impossible to simultaneously entertain and offend anyone (at least if the offense is genuine, rather than ironic). Absolute and sincere respect for the reader / viewer is a sine qua non.

    Unless you are dealing with children (the classic captive audience), you cannot convince anyone of anything. When an adult changes his or her mind, it is his or her own decision. As a propagandist, all you can do is offer up a few crude tools and tips which may be of some rough assistance in this enormous and delicate task.

    (For example, a lot of people when they’re working with the hole saw will try to hold their head still and position the drill by hand. Big mistake. You’ll get much cleaner, more accurate results if you clamp the drill in a vise and move only your head.)

    The world is awash in polemic. It’s dripping with the stuff. It’s encased itself in a gigantic sphere of radio-frequency polemic, 75 light-years in diameter and expanding at the speed of Hitler. But it is drowning for a drop of propaganda.

    Posted by: Mencius on March 19, 2007 12:12 PM

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 10:40 pm Reply | Quote
  • michael Says:

    We could link Moldbug on hitler but who died and made him God.
    I think a better use of time than a DENRx v altreich fight over this would be comparing cox to orlando dispassionately and all learn something maybe

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 11:00 pm Reply | Quote
  • Nxx Says:

    Something is happening, something strange. I agree with NRx that activism against an entrenched power is counterproductive but there’s been a disturbance in the data:

    1. “British support for remaining in the European Union has weakened in the wake of the murder of the pro-EU politician Jo Cox, according to an online research company Friday.”
    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2016/06/17/exclusive-poll-eu-support-falls-after-jo-cox-murder/86031038/

    2. “the popularity of the anti-immigration parties was strengthened, not weakened, after Anders Breivik’s attacks on the junior members of the pro-immigration party.”
    https://voxday.blogspot.com/2016/06/the-counterintuitive.html

    Why is the data telling us that attacking traitors is increasing, not decreasing, support for nationalism? This is a very important question because the implications are staggering:

    IF
    { attacking traitors increases support for nationalism }
    AND
    { increased support for nationalism causes more attacks on traitors }
    THEN
    { exponential feedback loop }
    UNTIL
    { all traitors dead }
    GOTO
    { nationalism prevails }

    [Reply]

    anon Reply:

    But, how could this be? That would be exactly how Pinochet, Mussolini, and Rodrigo Duterte rose in the past, and surely the only way that right-wing regimes have ever risen in the past cannot possibly happen today in the first world, because ABC News tells us we’re over that kind of thing, right?

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    I’ll give you Mussolini.

    [Reply]

    anon Reply:

    When you get the chance, a worthwhile topic for XS might be the rise of Rodrigo Duterte. The media were very much against him as well, but he kept saying right-wing and borderline vigilante-ist things, as a law-and-order schtick. And it turns out that you don’t really need the media on your side.

    I think we’ve recently entered the phase where enough people hate the media that you can plausibly do things the media dislikes, and succeed. It’s still hard, of course.

    Salvador Zarco Reply:

    Nick, I love how the one thing that comes to your mind when you say “doing anything positively valuable” is making a cryptocurrency. It’s pretty damn comical. Personally, I can hardly think of a more worthless, decadent, all-around waste of electricity than yet another cryptocurrency druggies and chinese tax dodgers will use to stash cash. It’s so silly that it’s hard to believe you’re serious.

    It still doesn’t seem to have dawned on any of you “passivists” that activism, tribalism, and violence actually work incredibly well and always have since the beginning of time. There is nothing more primeval, reactionary, -and that evokes eternal truth, – more than principled activism, heroic violence, and self-sacrifice. This absurd myth that “right wing activism always fails” is one of the stupidest things I’ve ever heard from the autistic Right. It shows how hopelessly out of touch with reality most e-reactionaries truly are.

    Lets just be honest here and state the fact that the “altright” is essentially a neo-nazi movement. It’s silly to act otherwise. The entire reason for the “altright” is activism (mainly online evangelism and verbal attacks) and it’s growing rapidly. The means Rightist regimes use to attain power: activism and violence. This is so goddamn obvious it’s painful to read intelligent people as they create bizarre rationalizations for why “activism fails.” It doesn’t fail. Even complete morons with zero money doing activist work often succeed. Even the Jacobites (MM ridiculously claimed to be a Jacobite) were fanatical activists and soldiers. Absolute monarchies that were restored to power did so through activism, not some laughable “apolitical property” theory that sounds like it was half baked by Lyndon LaRouche. Actual power is gained in increments via persuasion, intimidation, and elimination.

    But you like to argue, as if writing a piece of science fiction, that power is inverted, that activism and violence create the opposite outcome that was intended by those wielding activism and violence. Contrary to your amusingly hairbrained claims, activism and violence have been the agent of change and instrument of power by both the “authorities” and the “oppressed” for all human history and this is unmistakably crystal clear to almost everyone on the planet except you and a few so-called “neoreactionaries.”

    I’d be shocked if the UK was allowed to leave. I do not believe the vote matters because the liberal dictatorship will not allow it. That said, all historical evidence indicates that you are wrong, and that activism and indeed heinous violence, tends to be a great persuasive force for those who wield them.

    Now why on Earth would acts of violence by “nazi lunatics” actually make their political positions more popular? That’s an easy one. Outside of the condos and academic circlejerks and cushy break rooms and cryptocurrency discussion forums, there is a World that revolves around brutal violence and ear-splitting activism. That is the norm. Humans, being tribal primates, get excitement and rejuvenation from violence. Look at how we glorify war and killing. Isn’t it self-evident why people with even vaguely similar beliefs to a “violent lunatic” would be greatly empowered from the cathartic spectacle an outburst creates?

    The most taboo thing to notice in regards to these awful, tragic, crazed, lunatic, neonatzy, diabolical, appalling, mournful events: They have a secret and primal impact on a great many people. Nobody talks about it, of course. But those polls are more evidence of it. People’s reaction to these sort of things reveals everything about their true, deep down beliefs. Your reaction is one of fear and disgust. You react by condemning “neonazies” as a curse on the Right. You somehow claim the violence is liberal.

    But it appears that many in the UK did not have that response. Polls for “leave” rose. And I guarantee you that millions of people (who would publicly condemn what I’m saying) millions who had been fucked over by the liberals, who were harassed by muslims, who were raped by muslims, who were cleaned out in tax season, who did time in a government prison, who lost their job to a grinning jamaican, who saw a girl they wanted with an immigrant, or just hate the MPs, watched the news of Jo Cox slaying, saw her mourning family, and said in the back of their mind “fuck them.” And for one fleeting moment, they felt like their tribe got the better of the World. And liberal MPs will be more likely to check their anti-British rhetoric for fear that a “nazi lunatic” may be lurking nearby.

    Osama bin Laden is a hero in Pakistan and Anders Brevik is a hero on 4chan. Heroes make people stronger, serving as self-elected icons of the zeitgeist. You’ll keep calling them “poor creatures” awhile they are changing the course of history, and you moan on your blog about it.

    But you have painted yourself into a corner now, Nick. You can not wiggle your way back to the Left by condemning some naughty nazis. And now the Right seems disgusted by you. Perhaps, with the news of this murder, you’re beginning to realize your proximity to the “lunatic nazis.” Well, it doesn’t matter what you say now cause the Left categorizes you as a “lunatic nazi.” And to the Right, you’re just taking a crap on the doormat, using the killing as an opportunity to bash the active Right.

    You should have stuck to bitcoin.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    “But you have painted yourself into a corner now, Nick.” — Oh no, without a frothing mob to protect me! What a simply terrible situation to be in.

    I’ve enraged so many jackasses by this point that I’m, like, completely jackassless.

    [Reply]

    Salvador Zarco Reply:

    Iol don’t see how you could “dox” me Nick. My name is on the gravatar I signed in with. I’ve been going back on forth with you on twatter for a day now. I’m not fraught with narcissistic mortification over the idea people know what my opinion is. Are you suggesting you’d give out my real email or something? Interesting.

    Jo Cox was an apologist for the disgusting and enraging muslim rape gangs, who operated in her own constituency and now walk the streets of Britain free. She supported censorship of British men. She supported the EU, the relocation of millions more muslims, and effectively the extinction of British identity. She was a prog lunatic (if that isn’t a pleonasm). Yet you find her death an opportunity to bash the Right? As I said above, these sort of events are fascinating because real allegiances are quickly revealed. And like a true lefty, you believe only Rightist men should be held accountable for their actions. You failblogged this Nick, and now your peculiar made-up concepts like “horrorism” and “apolitical property” make even less sense.

    You: “Wish someone would do something really positive in all this like make a crypto-coin.” You’re so detached from reality, Nick. And it looks to me like “jackass” to you is anyone who is not a rootless childless cosmopolitan scamcoin trader who reblogs SPLC talking points.

    admin Reply:

    This “childless” thing is getting tedious, and would be even if it were true (which it isn’t, x2).

    4candles Reply:

    ‘You have to understand. Most people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured and so hopelessly dependent on the system that they will fight to protect it.’

    Isn’t that the essence of the red-pill? That these ‘enemies’ are no more than hostages to the Cathedral? Hostages that many of us here can, in a former life, relate to? And beyond that, taking out a few just leaves spaces to easily re-fill, and a wider desire to embrace the human security system? From a strictly NRx point of view, it’s impossible to view this and similar events as productive. If the alt-right wants to cling to some alt-Cathedral dreams, that’s fine, but it’s pretty clear why NRx views these as hopeless (and counter to its own ends).

    John Hannon Reply:

    Yes, but for all the done-down folk saying in the back of their mind “fuck them,” a likely much greater number will just see far right activism associated once again with mental illness – and not even mad people want to be associated with mental illness.

    BTW, latest polls now show “leave” has fallen, alas.

    [Reply]

    Salvador Zarco Reply:

    As I wrote before, the vote does not matter. The Eurocrats will do anything and everything to prevent Brexit up to and including blocking the polls, registering millions of migrants, rigging the ballot, forcing another referendum, causing economic collapse, and deploying military occupation. If Britain actually voted to leave and was allowed to peacefully go I would reassess everything I believe about democracy and liberalism. Another situation will likely unfold.

    This is all somewhat meaningless at this point. The stage for the final act has already been set. Entire cities are muslim. Western identity is dissolving. Europe lacks the will to even be itself. The young are fully warped pill-gobbling communists. And another business cycle is at its end. Even the so-called “reactionaries” are full of gays, hopeless cases, and guys like Nick, who bash the Right at any opportunity and basically think Blade Runner is a good outcome.

    But yes, “lunatic nazis” – sure. The association with mental illness may actually be a good thing. I don’t see many European newspapers publishing Mohammad cartoons, or eagerly bashing Islam. Wonder why?

    pedanticmoron Reply:

    The thing you and your ilk (i.e. mad morons in the comment sections of these past couple posts) aren’t grasping is that Land isn’t saying that right wing activism can never work, he’s saying that it won’t work now. Activism requires powerful backers in order to accomplish anything. People Power alone doesn’t work, without powerful interests on the side of the People Power the People Power will fail. The dissident right has no powerful interests on its side, this is why your activism is doomed to fail. Do you sincerely believe that your People’s Revolution can overturn the existing power structure of the modern West?

    People Power only works in two scenarios: you have such overwhelming amounts of people that the government simply can’t win (and even then you’d have to contend with the entire non-American progressive world), or you have to have the backing of a powerful interest that wishes to see the power structure you’re fighting against changed. Neither of these are going to happen, you have no course for victory.

    Passive resistance is the correct course of action for one reason and one reason alone: you have no powerful interests backing you that can contend with DC. The idea that People Power alone can contend with DC is complete lunacy. It’s also a quite leftist idea, which makes for some sweet irony.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    we wont know if we have powerful allies in high places if we dont send up a flare. signalling faggotry doesnt instill others to take risks

    Dividualist Reply:

    Activism and violence works, but only if supported by part of the elites. This is the actual NRx theory. Military or police leaders can support it by looking the other way or intellectual, political leaders can support it by telling military and police leaders to look the other way. But currently, it is not happening, hence right-wing activism and violence seems pretty doomed.

    There is many evidence that currently the police loves to crush right-wing violence and there are no right-wing intellectual elites telling them to be moderate. While when there is left-wing violence, left-wing elites always hold the police and military back.

    [Reply]

    Alrenous Reply:

    Yes, but you don’t go far enough.

    A truly right-wing government has no need for street activists. If it is going to support street activists, it makes it unnecessary by stating so openly. If Weimar Germany were a truly right-wing state, it would have outlawed communists and had done with it…most likely gutting Nazi popular support at the same stroke.

    K.L.Anderson Reply:

    It seems to me that you need to bring in the difference between short-term success—versions of fascism—and long term success—versions of ethnopluralistic (not multicultural) conservatism. Then there is the more important steady evolution that often stops when the fascist turn over the chess table, and also the central judgment of successful survival and reproduction, which usually dies in the wars the fascists like. Defense yes, but defense of long-term life and evolution. What else is more important?

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 18th, 2016 at 11:36 pm Reply | Quote
  • Asher Says:

    Isn’t the truly passivist response to just shrug and mention that “shit happens”? It’s also quite fun. Maybe I’m missing something.

    [Reply]

    anon Reply:

    You misunderstand, Asher.

    In the same way that Obama cares more about signaling against Trump than about signaling against the Allahu Gaybar shooter, Nick Land’s primary concern here is about signaling against the mentally ill guy who shot a traitor, so that no lefties can say that he’s on the side of the prole nazis.

    He’s made clear that he dislikes the monster more than he dislikes Dr. Franken-thedral. Nick had to move to a place where he doesn’t understand the locals well enough to hate them, and he believes that this is proof that he’s superior to the low quality human capital that didn’t have the insight to abandon the country of their birth.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    “He’s made clear that he dislikes the monster more than he dislikes Dr. Franken-thedral.” — Bullshit. Cathedral-slamming gets vastly more attention here than retarded-Nazi dissing, as you fully realize. Problem with you guys (among many) is that you expect some kind of tribal all-in. “If you’re against mass Muslim immigration, then you should love the smell of my dog when it’s releasing gas.” That’s not the way it works among anybody but imbecile fanatics.

    [Reply]

    anon Reply:

    “Problem with you guys (among many) is that you expect some kind of tribal all-in.”

    And yet nobody had a problem with you, until you declared that the monster shouldn’t live.

    I think most of the comments say the same thing as I’m saying: we expect you to have the sense to not echo and validate Cthulhu’s moral authority, by signaling that blood is always invalid by definition. And no, you don’t have to love this particular guy in order to refrain from denouncing 100% of guys.

    As MM says: validity depends upon whether the act is effective. That is all.

    admin Reply:

    “until you declared that the monster shouldn’t live” — Do you think I’m freaking Fnargl?

    I’m saying that NRx shouldn’t align with the monster, and would further say (if I haven’t already) that civilized types would sensibly aim for firm geopolitical separation from it. Give the damn thing a state.

    holipopiloh Reply:

    Involuntary allegiance has nothing to do with it. You’re actively legitimising the Left (all the while claiming it as an enemy). No amount of screeching and faux-elitism is going to cover for that.

    (No one demanded that you praise the loon’s actions. No one. So stop cutting your nose to spite your face.)

    admin Reply:

    “Legitimizing the Left” by noting that stabbing an unarmed woman to death in the street is not a great thing. You guys are real comedians.

    holipopiloh Reply:

    You did a lot more than noting, Nick. Don’t pretend it was otherwise.

    anon Reply:

    You’ve said a heck of a lot more than that, Nick.

    anon Reply:

    “I’m saying that NRx shouldn’t align with the monster, and would further say (if I haven’t already) that civilized types would sensibly aim for firm geopolitical separation from it. Give the damn thing a state.”

    The above is very different from declaring that “we” (the Right) should actively suppress, dissociate from, denounce anybody willing to break the law. Very different.

    Passively not giving the Monster a public hug is different from actively interfering with it. Passively remaining unallied, while not actively and publicly punching for the Cathedral, is rational enough.

    Posted on June 19th, 2016 at 12:48 am Reply | Quote
  • Grotesque Body Says:

    Jekyll and Hyde is a more faithful analogy.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    I don’t agree. Several centuries of leftist social engineering have produced their ‘New Man’ — and it’s drooling on the carpet, with a bloody dagger in its hand.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 19th, 2016 at 1:32 am Reply | Quote
  • Anon Says:

    For all the supposed icy calmness of some of the commenters here who feel compelled to stroke their own egos, there is a profound lack of insight.

    What are you trying to Exit from, Nick? What is it that you wish to preserve?

    Humans are apes. It’s violence all the way down. Me and my brother against my cousin, me and my cousin against…

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    Differential civilization complicates any such universal evaluation. It’s apes all the way down, but the apes in Singapore don’t behave like the apes in Fallujah. The Alt-Right is obviously closer to the Fallujah end of the spectrum.

    [Reply]

    Asher Reply:

    You sure about that, Nick? Off the top of head, the apes in the Alt-Right probably have an inbreeding coefficient far closer to that of Singapore than to apes in Fallujah. Inbreeding coefficient is a really BFD.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    I’m starting from empirical primatology. (The theory comes second.)

    Asher Reply:

    What hard evidence do we have for differences or similarities between different groups of apes? I gave inbreeding coefficients as what I considered a counterexample to your claim. What specific primatological evidence should I be assessing?

    Asher Reply:

    Michael Anissimov doesn’t count

    Posted on June 19th, 2016 at 2:08 am Reply | Quote
  • Asher Says:

    @Grotesque Body
    I could be reading you wrong but blaming leftist social engineering looks like a “free will” based argument. In a world of cause and effect everything that exists is an effect of prior causes. And leftist social engineering is simply and effect of something else. I don’t pretend to have an answer to that inquiry but it seems that answer is pretty important to this discussion.

    The most obvious answer is simply brute technological advancement, which seems to make technological advancement synonymous with leftism. I know, past does not necessarily predict future, Hume and all, but that’s probably an unsettling conclusion for most of your readers.

    I’m still leaning toward “shit happens” as the best response to such events.

    [Reply]

    Asher Reply:

    oops, that last comment was a response to admin

    [Reply]

    Lucian Reply:

    I could tell; if you’re invoking spooks like ’cause’ and ‘effect’ there’s no way I’m the target audience.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 19th, 2016 at 2:14 am Reply | Quote
  • Outliers (#10) Says:

    […] im po. Conspiracy. Diversity incoherence. Faustian stirrings. Democracy wobbles. Frankenstein’s monster (the Revolution). American corruption (flashback). Paradoxical virtue sigs. Security […]

    Posted on June 19th, 2016 at 5:02 am Reply | Quote
  • Froude Society Says:

    Who do you think is attracted to dissident Rightwing thought? Any consideration of their likely psychology? I know you paccifists understand that the overwhelming majority of the people in the outer-Right approve of violence. Adorno wasn’t fudging too much of the truth when he outlined “the Authoritarian Personality”. People drawn to non-liberationist politics are bound by their essential natures to see bloodshed as merit-able and acceptable. Good historical regimes killed people and went to war constantly over a whole host of things no libertyfiend would ever approve of. The “non-aggression” principle is reforged into “passivism” and everyone gets duped. Guess it ain’t too hard to make yellow things white. If you see what Tommy did as “moster[ous]”, horrifying, or disgusting- you are psycho-spiritually not a Reactionary, this is a bourgeoisie-Whig response drawn from bourgeoisie-Whig morality. Take any Reactionary figure from the past into the present via a time machine (exit capital?) and I guarantee most would instantly engage in martyrdom operations against the enemy, preferring a return to death rather than “enjoying the decline”.

    [Reply]

    Ahote Reply:

    >moster[ous], horrifying, or disgusting

    Counterproductive was the exact word.

    [Reply]

    Erebus Reply:

    Very true.

    What occurred was not “monster[ous], horrifying, or disgusting”; it should inspire no strong feelings one way or the other. As Nxx noted above, it does not appear to have been “counterproductive” insofar as the Right is concerned. But, having said that, neither was it beneficial. A worthless, replaceable, fundamentally empty politician — one who quite clearly held England in contempt — was killed by a madman who, in turn, held her in contempt. On balance, the world lost two hollow shells. The politician shall be replaced by somebody who holds the exact same opinions, the madman shall spend the rest of his days in state care, and nothing else shall change.

    …I just don’t see why anybody should care.

    It is, of course, also true that most of the outer-right does condone this sort of violence. Perfectly understandable. They’re wrong to think that isolated acts of murder will lead to any sort of positive change, but it is unquestionably true that their dark-faced goddess Nemesis appreciates the blood-soaked tribute.

    [Reply]

    Axel Mckibbin Reply:

    I agree. This is all Much Ado About Nothing.

    [Reply]

    anon Reply:

    I agree. This kind of thing does us no favors.

    Johan Schmidt Reply:

    People are not interchangeable. If Churchill had died in New York, Neville Chamberlain or Lord Halifax would not have stood up and said “We shall fight them on the beaches” in his stead.

    Pop quiz: her husband, initials BC, was accused of sexual harassment by multiple women, but she stood by him. Am I talking about JC or HRC? The parallels are striking… except HRC had actually worked in the private sector.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 19th, 2016 at 7:09 am Reply | Quote
  • JRM Says:

    There may be a different explanation for admins position re: violent outliers.

    Could it be simple pragmatism? A form of CYA?

    After all, hosting an official web site that looks favorably on political (if that’s really what it was) assassination leaves one rather exposed. The SPLC might even take note of it.

    However, provoking many commenters to declare acceptance of “extreme prejudice” behavior must serve some purpose. I wonder what it could be?

    In contradiction to many (including admin) who have expressed distaste at the untoward nature of this discussion, I must say these comments have proven quite interesting.

    Thought experiment: what if the assassination was to be followed by copycats, and other members of the dispossessed class began targeting politicians with Leftist prescriptions (aka all “legitimate” elected officials in the West)?

    Besides greater isolation and heavily revamped security, what would we expect to see in terms of the social/political ramifications? Understanding the usefulness of this act should involve some calculation about the effects of it, should we see more or less contagious susceptibility to it.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    Thats the million bitcoin question What MM and admin predict is holiness signalling might morph into outright martyr signalling its certainly a distinct possibility that no matter how many race traitors are blown up leftys decide to signal holiness by tweeting some modern version of the gold stars of David the danes are alleged to have done. Its so easy to imagine this in fact that its almost a certainty it would happen for a while. On the other hand drawing cartoons of mohamed didnt last long did it.And even if committed leftists decide to taunt lions doent mean the coliseum set wont still cheer the lion.
    If your aluding to a conspiracy theory its tempting I think the different strategies of the right are most effective appearing as separate entities as long as possible so land being shocked shocked there are nazis in his comment section would be smart if he were doing that i would hope he were also reaching out behind the scenes to keep some coordination going but hey I also wonder sometimes if moldbug isnt really a secret lefty who anticipated the inevitability of an a reaction and decided to draw them into the open early in the game.

    [Reply]

    anon Reply:

    The Danes never wore golden stars in sympathy, that’s a myth. The King wrote about it as an option in his diary, but never did it, because the Germans never made the Danish Jews wear stars.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 19th, 2016 at 7:06 pm Reply | Quote
  • JRM Says:

    @JRM

    Interesting. There’s a bonus points issue here that I’ve seen less discussion about but I can’t help but feel we’re being trolled by the admin’s repetition of indignation that a woman was targeted.

    But wait, doesn’t he know that the Cathedral has blessed female soldiers? Combat positions and potential conscription, no less.

    Not to mention the heavily-memed notion of women as Europa’s downfall, urging on more refugees until everything WESTERN CIV is swallowed up by a rising brown tide.

    In sympathy the comments section swells up like some kind of Rorschach shit test response.

    [Reply]

    anon Reply:

    I wish it were true that Nick was being clever.

    But no, I think he really is using her gender to justify his deep desire to loudly signal on twitter against violence done by poor, desperate, white Right-wingers.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 19th, 2016 at 9:48 pm Reply | Quote
  • Excremental Pessimism Says:

    @Asher
    This thread is too good. Oh, XS said a neo-Nazi is a piece of shit, XS is validating the Left. If yo’ll can’t see that deeming this mad as a mentally ill neo-Nazi is a quintessential Cathedral tactic then I don’t know what else would. Reducing XS to dialectical incompetence blows my mind. If yo’ll wana have your own tribe of ‘authentic’ alt-righties that includes people like this man then please, please, by all means do it. Meanwhile, I’m heading for the exit.

    PS if you can’t understanding the importance or benefit of ‘apolitical property’ or decentralised currency then you should probably stay in the catabolic digestion of the West.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 20th, 2016 at 1:49 am Reply | Quote
  • michael Says:

    You walk into the room with your pencil in your hand
    You see somebody naked and you say, “Who is that man?”
    You try so hard but you don’t understand
    Just what you will say when you get home
    Because something is happening here but you don’t know what it is
    Do you, Mr. Jones?

    You raise up your head and you ask, “Is this where it is?”
    And somebody points to you and says, “It’s his”
    And you say, “What’s mine?” and somebody else says, “Well, what is?”
    And you say, “Oh my God, am I here all alone?”
    But something is happening and you don’t know what it is
    Do you, Mr. Jones?

    You hand in your ticket and you go watch the geek
    Who immediately walks up to you when he hears you speak
    And says, “How does it feel to be such a freak?”
    And you say, “Impossible!” as he hands you a bone
    And something is happening here but you don’t know what it is
    Do you, Mr. Jones?

    You have many contacts among the lumberjacks
    To get you facts when someone attacks your imagination
    But nobody has any respect, anyway they already expect you to all give a check
    To tax-deductible charity organizations

    Ah, you’ve been with the professors and they’ve all liked your looks
    With great lawyers you have discussed lepers and crooks
    You’ve been through all of F. Scott Fitzgerald’s books
    You’re very well-read, it’s well-known
    But something is happening here and you don’t know what it is
    Do you, Mr. Jones?

    Well, the sword swallower, he comes up to you and then he kneels
    He crosses himself and then he clicks his high heels
    And without further notice, he asks you how it feels
    And he says, “Here is your throat back, thanks for the loan”
    And you know something is happening but you don’t know what it is
    Do you, Mr. Jones?

    Now, you see this one-eyed midget shouting the word “Now”
    And you say, “For what reason?” and he says, “How”
    And you say, “What does this mean?” and he screams back, “You’re a cow!
    Give me some milk or else go home”
    And you know something’s happening but you don’t know what it is
    Do you, Mr. Jones?

    Well, you walk into the room like a camel, and then you frown
    You put your eyes in your pocket and your nose on the ground
    There ought to be a law against you comin’ around
    You should be made to wear earphones
    ‘Cause something is happening and you don’t know what it is
    Do you, Mr. Jones?

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 20th, 2016 at 12:59 pm Reply | Quote
  • SVErshov Says:

    if objective is purely ideological, then let your enemy do your job (which you unable to do anyway). with left been impregnated by rightists theoretical concepts, what better tool to wish for, considering the fact of left dominance.

    [Reply]

    Posted on June 20th, 2016 at 6:15 pm Reply | Quote

Leave a comment