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	<title>Comments on: Imitation Games</title>
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	<link>http://www.xenosystems.net/imitation-games/</link>
	<description>Involvements with reality</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 05 Feb 2015 06:56:00 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Outside in - Involvements with reality &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Poe&#8217;s Law</title>
		<link>http://www.xenosystems.net/imitation-games/#comment-81170</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Outside in - Involvements with reality &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Poe&#8217;s Law]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jul 2014 15:10:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xenosystems.net/?p=2434#comment-81170</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[&#8230;] Evidently, Poe&#8217;s Law can be construed as a filter of the same kind. Satire is effective to exactly the extent it can be confused with the satirized. (This can be taken in comparatively serious directions.) [&#8230;]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Evidently, Poe&#8217;s Law can be construed as a filter of the same kind. Satire is effective to exactly the extent it can be confused with the satirized. (This can be taken in comparatively serious directions.) [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Lightning Round -2014/04/23 &#124; Free Northerner</title>
		<link>http://www.xenosystems.net/imitation-games/#comment-41408</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lightning Round -2014/04/23 &#124; Free Northerner]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Apr 2014 05:03:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xenosystems.net/?p=2434#comment-41408</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[&#8230;] On the  Turing test. [&#8230;]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] On the  Turing test. [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: nydwracu</title>
		<link>http://www.xenosystems.net/imitation-games/#comment-38797</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[nydwracu]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2014 10:27:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xenosystems.net/?p=2434#comment-38797</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;perhaps we do not have Kings (or people with natural authority) because they are atypical to the mass in some way and therefore must either lie to the point of forgetting their real natural way of behaving, suppress it, or drop out of society in some fashion, perhaps not merely asocial but anti-social.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
You should watch Gintama.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>perhaps we do not have Kings (or people with natural authority) because they are atypical to the mass in some way and therefore must either lie to the point of forgetting their real natural way of behaving, suppress it, or drop out of society in some fashion, perhaps not merely asocial but anti-social.</p></blockquote>
<p>You should watch Gintama.</p>
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		<title>By: georgesdelatour</title>
		<link>http://www.xenosystems.net/imitation-games/#comment-38777</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[georgesdelatour]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2014 09:40:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xenosystems.net/?p=2434#comment-38777</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;the idea is that a cognition could emerge from a computing substrate.&quot; Why? It hasn&#039;t in humans.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;the idea is that a cognition could emerge from a computing substrate.&#8221; Why? It hasn&#8217;t in humans.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: nydwracu</title>
		<link>http://www.xenosystems.net/imitation-games/#comment-38648</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[nydwracu]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2014 03:47:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xenosystems.net/?p=2434#comment-38648</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[They aren&#039;t very good at it, but &lt;a href=&quot;https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_theorem_proving&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;they&#039;re getting better.&lt;/a&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They aren&#8217;t very good at it, but <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_theorem_proving" rel="nofollow">they&#8217;re getting better.</a></p>
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		<title>By: Moe</title>
		<link>http://www.xenosystems.net/imitation-games/#comment-38628</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Moe]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2014 02:59:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xenosystems.net/?p=2434#comment-38628</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It is an error to conflate mathematics with computation. An AI that cannot derive General Relativity (or something better) from what came before GR does not possess super-human intelligence.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is an error to conflate mathematics with computation. An AI that cannot derive General Relativity (or something better) from what came before GR does not possess super-human intelligence.</p>
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		<title>By: Moe</title>
		<link>http://www.xenosystems.net/imitation-games/#comment-38621</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Moe]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2014 02:47:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xenosystems.net/?p=2434#comment-38621</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Furthermore, mathematics is not arithmetic. Mathematics is, at least in part, a creative endeavor that often requires imaginative leaps and new frameworks. Machines still aren&#039;t very good at that.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Furthermore, mathematics is not arithmetic. Mathematics is, at least in part, a creative endeavor that often requires imaginative leaps and new frameworks. Machines still aren&#8217;t very good at that.</p>
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		<title>By: HowardV</title>
		<link>http://www.xenosystems.net/imitation-games/#comment-38499</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[HowardV]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2014 21:20:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xenosystems.net/?p=2434#comment-38499</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;Cognition is not simply computing&quot;

The words are not synonyms, but as mentioned above, the idea is that a cognition could emerge from a computing substrate.

As for the Turing Test, it&#039;s not to test whether a computer can feign answers.  It&#039;s an admission that we can&#039;t have some kind of &#039;interior&#039; test of cognition.  Why assume the worst (that a computer can&#039;t be intelligent/sentient/conscious), instead use external criteria?

Whether a conversation with a human is a good external criterion is questionable.  If an AI outfoxed us in many ways, but refused to have a conversation, for how long would we consider it stupid?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Cognition is not simply computing&#8221;</p>
<p>The words are not synonyms, but as mentioned above, the idea is that a cognition could emerge from a computing substrate.</p>
<p>As for the Turing Test, it&#8217;s not to test whether a computer can feign answers.  It&#8217;s an admission that we can&#8217;t have some kind of &#8216;interior&#8217; test of cognition.  Why assume the worst (that a computer can&#8217;t be intelligent/sentient/conscious), instead use external criteria?</p>
<p>Whether a conversation with a human is a good external criterion is questionable.  If an AI outfoxed us in many ways, but refused to have a conversation, for how long would we consider it stupid?</p>
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		<title>By: RiverC</title>
		<link>http://www.xenosystems.net/imitation-games/#comment-38495</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[RiverC]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2014 21:13:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xenosystems.net/?p=2434#comment-38495</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[That was my impression, too. On our 286 Dell Dimension my dad (a clinical psychologist) had a program you could teach to respond &#039;normally&#039; (through conversation) to pass a turing test. But the fact that I&#039;ve known some aspies who were called &#039;computers&#039; makes the connection clear.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That was my impression, too. On our 286 Dell Dimension my dad (a clinical psychologist) had a program you could teach to respond &#8216;normally&#8217; (through conversation) to pass a turing test. But the fact that I&#8217;ve known some aspies who were called &#8216;computers&#8217; makes the connection clear.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: georgesdelatour</title>
		<link>http://www.xenosystems.net/imitation-games/#comment-38489</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[georgesdelatour]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2014 20:59:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xenosystems.net/?p=2434#comment-38489</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Computers are better at computing than humans. But cognition is not simply computation.

I thought the Turing test was mainly about testing the computer&#039;s ability to feign answers to questions for which computer algorithms provide no obvious model - something more like the Voight-Kampff polygraph-type test in Blade Runner.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Computers are better at computing than humans. But cognition is not simply computation.</p>
<p>I thought the Turing test was mainly about testing the computer&#8217;s ability to feign answers to questions for which computer algorithms provide no obvious model &#8211; something more like the Voight-Kampff polygraph-type test in Blade Runner.</p>
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