Pan-Secessionism

Here’s the All Nations Party vision of the American future:

ANP00-Map

Some background, and a discussion with Keith Preston on the topic.

The party-political strategy is clearly questionable, but it deserves more engagement than I’ve noticed in NRx circles. A path to Patchwork has to be something — and this is something.

(AnarchoAbsurdist is all over this at the moment, for e.g. linking to another ANP video.)

ADDED: A vehement critique of Preston from the far left that is well worth a read.

September 7, 2015admin 26 Comments »
FILED UNDER :Political economy

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26 Responses to this entry

  • Pan-Secessionism | Neoreactive Says:

    […] By admin […]

    Posted on September 7th, 2015 at 5:40 am Reply | Quote
  • AwesomeJon Says:

    I’m from New Mexico. Does this dude have any idea he’s just condemned the most important military resources in the country to eternal factionalism and likely mass death by bureaucratic infighting over Vargas’s legacy, drought and hantavirus? “mestizo” is a simplistic, stereotypical broad brush way to get people killed. I wouldn’t trust the Mormons with their own state for a while either. The leadership lacks confidence in anything other than capitulation. The problem is the national proposals are the Schelling point at present. That means Texnats and Anglos, Indians, Taosano hippies, military personnel and hybrids of one or more categories by birth or heritage are out in the cold because they’re not mestizos, which leaves the party divided already. This is not totally a reason not to work with this, but it does make it a proposal that needs work, and it’s one of those subvert democracy to end democracy things. I’m not sure. I’m also tired. Sigh.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    It seems like a mistake to get bogged down in the territorial specifics. There’s a preliminary coalition-building phase to be thrashed-through first.

    [Reply]

    AwesomeJon Reply:

    Right. Which is why the idea being proposed and territory being defined along inaccurate ethnic lines, by a leftist to serve leftist interests rather than the actual ethnic divisions in the region (and my clan and our food and language and accent are not reflective of Preston’s grasp) is a real issue. Because the Schelling points we have to attract people are either competitions with his or the map and the All Nations Party.

    I admit I’m playing somewhat of a Socratic exercise. It’s easy to be contentious this late and I’m drunk. On Cuervo Tradicional, because I’m weird at ethnocentrist straw men lol. But I have serious issues with joining forces with people without more of a game plan than “kill them and take what we want after the revolution”. It’s something to go on. But you’re not there until you’ve solved the Texans. Oh boy.

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    Posted on September 7th, 2015 at 6:30 am Reply | Quote
  • Chris B Says:

    Politics as wish again.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    Fragmentation? Or, the specific path to fragmentation?
    If the latter, I might agree. If the former, you’re turning your back on Patchwork. (And without Patchwork I see no reason for the slightest interest in any other aspect of NRx.)

    [Reply]

    Erebus Reply:

    This seems like politics as wish to me:

    “Sectarian separatist movements all go nowhere because they lack the numbers to win elections at the Federal level. The All Nations Party target coalition does have that potential.”

    And then they assume that they’ll be able to do anything should they win elections. That does not seem like a sound assumption to me.

    The destination they seek is an extremely desirable one — much more desirable than El Dorado or any empire out of myth — but the path these guys have charted is utterly hopeless.

    Moldbug’s Antiversity idea may be a nice bottom-up way to convince people of the fact that secessionism is both viable and desirable. The Universities are imploding, are no longer very good at serving their intended function, and an alternative would quickly look very good indeed.
    …There are also other ways, of course. But most involve war or the threat of war, so there’s no point in discussing them right now.

    [Reply]

    chris b Reply:

    @admin the path and the desired entities presented. As for patchwork itself, it’s an interesting thought experiment based on the concept of having rational sovereigns. There are many issues here which haven’t even begun to be excavated so I’m not even remotely treating it as a given.

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    Posted on September 7th, 2015 at 7:37 am Reply | Quote
  • Lucian of Samosata Says:

    Surely the most accurate representation would colour every tile brown.

    [Reply]

    Posted on September 7th, 2015 at 7:40 am Reply | Quote
  • SanguineEmpiricist Says:

    Psychologically, for me, I hope there is a chant along the lines of “Separate but still together”. That’s the idea I had for breaking up California into a separate ciity states.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    Tech-comms will be open for business with anyone. Can’t speak for other tendencies.

    [Reply]

    Posted on September 7th, 2015 at 9:19 am Reply | Quote
  • E. Antony Gray (@RiverC) Says:

    I don’t know about putting Florida in with us. Otherwise, it’s not bad. Of course, some of these patches will not last, either because they represent foolishly aggressive tendencies militarily, or poisonously toxic tendencies ideologically. Once Boston doesn’t have the world’s armies, it will likely last less than a century.

    As for the Mestizos, they are not a cosmic race – they aren’t even a race. The most they are capable of is being someone’s tool in an ethnic conflict. After this they become helots. I wonder though who will be their new masters?

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    Among the great attractions of this scheme — at least in its more highly-developed stages — is the prospect of states dying with the regularity of business enterprises.

    [Reply]

    Posted on September 7th, 2015 at 1:41 pm Reply | Quote
  • michael Says:

    I think the plan should be to push for the right to exit for some state on liberal grounds negotiate that states autonomy along the original idea of confederated states sharing a military and economy. once the precedent is set use it to negotiate other states the same autonomy without actually leaving. the states already have fully functioning governments constistutions borders etc many actually run themselves or almost did until recently if only from neglect.

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    Posted on September 7th, 2015 at 3:44 pm Reply | Quote
  • vxxc2014 Says:

    “And without Patchwork I see no reason for the slightest interest in any other aspect of NRx.”
    There are many aspects of NRx.

    Go sell the Chinese on patchwork. I’m sure they’ll be enthused. Or Yarvin can go hawk it in Israel. You can’t even be sure Yarvin is serious from reading UR and he probably has changed his mind by now. Patchwork is pure mischief at best, for that matter at worst.

    Bitter at the United States and jealous of Americans motivate councils of Balkanization and horrible suffering.
    It’s Libertarianism descending into nihilism once the Libertarian realizes his ideas aren’t practical – so burn it all down then.

    [Reply]

    chris b Reply:

    The usa is a hiddeous “nation” tearing the world apart. The joke is how “patriots” could read the history of the USA and not see that. But that is part of the fraud and idiocy at the heart of american rightism. Some guys with love of eagles or some shit told the tyranical king of England to “sod off”, then something, something, Lincoln freed the slaves, someting, something we kicked Hitler’s ass, someting, something, the civil rights movement was a towering acievement, something something yay democracy. Let’s vote Obama out!

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    Dale Rooster Reply:

    ” Patchwork is pure mischief at best, for that matter at worst.”

    Decentralization of the horribly destructive USG and the dispersion of power through a collection of competitive city-states or mini-nations is mischief? Perhaps you would prefer a global community controlled indirectly by the Cathedral and led by USG, whose goal is nothing less than worldwide economic and cultural dominance, whose policy can be summed thus: Stand in the way of Progress, Equality or Democracy, and be destroyed.

    “Bitter at the United States and jealous of Americans motivate councils of Balkanization and horrible suffering.”

    Resentment is indeed a poor attitude to embrace in life but at times it’s warranted. Also, it’s the Land of the Free that’s been the cause of horrible suffering of millions both at home and abroad since 1860 or so. (Or perhaps you think Lincoln was a good guy.) Balkanization could very well put an end to that. You have it backwards.

    “It’s Libertarianism descending into nihilism once the Libertarian realizes his ideas aren’t practical – so burn it all down then.”

    And the USSR never should have collapsed. To see the advantages of such a tragic event is pure nihilism.

    [Reply]

    admin Reply:

    China already has enclaves vastly more autonomous than anything tolerated by the USA (Hong Kong and Macau, most prominently). They work brilliantly. Only a deranged mega-statist would see the proliferation of such entities as some kind of vandalism.

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    Posted on September 7th, 2015 at 4:53 pm Reply | Quote
  • Hard Right Says:

    LMAO at Black Nation in the South.

    Call it New Haiti.

    [Reply]

    Chris B Reply:

    The absurdity of nationalism is that majority rules. OK, lets fill the “nation” with blacks. Majority rules.

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    Posted on September 7th, 2015 at 7:10 pm Reply | Quote
  • Durtal Says:

    ‘Call it New Haiti’.

    Or, better still, ‘Suanee’:

    ‘We had profited well by the latest treaties with France and England; the exclusion of foreign born Jews as a measure of nation self-preservation, the settlement of the new independent negro state of Suanee, the checking of immigration, the new laws concerning naturalization, and the gradual centralization of power in the executive all contributed to national calm and prosperity.’ (‘The Repairer of Reputations’ from ‘The King in Yelllow’)

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    Posted on September 8th, 2015 at 12:37 am Reply | Quote
  • Barnabas Says:

    I agree that this has always looked like wishfull thinking. Regional cultural and ethnic distinctions are rapidly breaking down due to intranational and international economic migration as well as mass media cultural leveling. Where are the historic models and how well do they fit? Economic collapse is given as a sort of Deus ex machina but is there any sign of Venezuela breaking up?

    [Reply]

    Posted on September 8th, 2015 at 2:01 am Reply | Quote
  • freihals Says:

    AnarchoAbsurdist wonderfully piled on to this in his conversation on Twitter with @Planless_order.

    https://twitter.com/Planless_Order/status/640824158637694976
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/govbeat/wp/2013/11/08/which-of-the-11-american-nations-do-you-live-in/

    and

    https://twitter.com/Planless_Order/status/640847421224783872
    http://www.georgianewsday.com/news/regional/202296-the-124-states-of-america-a-look-at-the-usa-that-could-have-been.html

    I kind of like the idea of 124 states. Strikes me as a whole lot of freedom of association and exit opportunity. One remark–if given this then you’d better have a well-honed and highly sought after skill set.

    [Reply]

    Erebus Reply:

    It doesn’t matter how many states you have when you’ve got (a) an overbearing federal government which likes to throw its weight around, and (b) only one arbiter of correct and fashionable thought; the official religion of the state, which blesses those who adhere to its Progressive tenets, and damns and shames those who don’t. (The Cathedral’s university/media duality is diabolically effective.)

    …The differences between states right now are largely trivia; they all take their marching orders from the same place. No reason to suppose it would be different with the addition of more states — and it might conceivably be worse, in that the federal government may push for an even stronger regulatory hand, for obvious reasons.

    [Reply]

    Posted on September 8th, 2015 at 3:12 am Reply | Quote
  • This Week in Reaction (2015/09/13) | The Reactivity Place Says:

    […] Nick Land points with some approval at hidden gem by a curious observer from January. Yuray left a comment there at the time. I could swear I’d seen this post, but find no link from me to it. Until now. Also from Land: Pan-Secessionism. […]

    Posted on September 14th, 2015 at 9:07 pm Reply | Quote
  • Lightning Round – 2015/09/15 | Free Northerner Says:

    […] Pan-secessionism. […]

    Posted on September 16th, 2015 at 5:02 am Reply | Quote

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