It’s too early to give up on libertarians.
— James (@jpayneancap) August 21, 2016
— James (@jpayneancap) August 21, 2016
They should put a photo of Appomattox next to it.
The problem is that modern society is a disease, and it consumes all that it can.
Hoping to secede is, while an extension of the conservative principle of localism, as much a misreading of the situation as those who hoped to simply pay the Mongol tariff and avoid invasion.
michael Reply:August 22nd, 2016 at 11:23 pm
Im not so sure so much cathedral propaganda is tied up in the right to choose if you could get a state to brexit i dont think they would dare stop it. they would fight like hell to keep that vote from going against them though.
Alice Teller Reply:August 23rd, 2016 at 12:19 am
Sadly, that one simple trick to fix everything is not available right now. One step at a time. Much as some may wish otherwise, people are organic.
I got into it last night with two of my Prog cousins who were berating me for refusing to acknowledge my white privilege. (My go-to response for this point is to double down with, “Sure, I recognize it. I just call it white pride.”) They gasp and Wow Just Wowed after that. It was great. I love those girls, but goddamn if you have Prog family, it’s a great way to test the forces of Light and Goodness for their tolerance of Un-good thought systems. Anyhow, one of them said, “We’re on the brink of another Civil War, Dale.” I was kind of surprised. I didn’t think Progs realized that. Then she said, “I mean, it never ended! The Civil War never ended!”
I told them that I would totally support any and all secessionist movements. Then, the same cousin said, “I just want to reinforce what my hero Bernie said, which is that we’re all in this together. And we should all just love one another.” To which I replied, “I totally agree. That’s why we need to stop banning Confederate Flags and monuments. Show our love to cigarette smokers. And protect the liberty of all those stupid, backwards Rednecks and gun-toters out there.” The convo ended after that.
They don’t get how goddamn creepy and totalitarian their vision is—global unity “we’re all in this together, let’s just love one another” but we’re on the brink of Civil War so we better make sure that no one separates, etc. I don’t think Progs even understand what totalitarianism is anymore or that it exists. Anyhow, yeah, real libertarians understand why Exit is critical. Moldbug should be mandatory reading for libertarians. Voice is for Gary Johnson fakes.
wu-wei Reply:August 22nd, 2016 at 5:48 pm
It takes a special breed of libertarian to even begin to become sympathetic to Moldbug’s writing. I’m sure there must exist a few other converts who come from different ideological/epistemological backgrounds, but honestly it’s a bit difficult for me to fathom.
Dale Rooster Reply:August 22nd, 2016 at 6:12 pm
It’s an interesting topic. Most libertarians, I think, are either philosophy majors (as I was) or computer-science types. Some are good ol’ boy Red-State (Goldwater) libertarian types. (Again, this is me.) Is it really that big of jump from Hoppe to Moldbug?
wu-wei Reply:August 22nd, 2016 at 9:10 pm
>Is it really that big of jump from Hoppe to Moldbug?
Not at all. But then, most self-described libertarians are hardly of the Hoppe (or even Rothbard/Friedman anarcho-capitalist sympathetic) variety.
Lucian Reply:August 22nd, 2016 at 10:52 pm
Slate Star Cuck once noted that most of the third ‘grey tribe’ that the blue tribe is currently trying to co-opt or silence is made of computer science nerds, engineers and other IT professionals. The professionalisation of ICT and digitisation of everything is going to make a much bigger impact on the range of acceptable political views than has yet been appreciated. Moldbug and Thiel are only the start of it.
Ahote Reply:August 23rd, 2016 at 8:31 am
Mises Institute has been linking to Moldbug every now and then.
michael Reply:August 22nd, 2016 at 11:29 pm
Moldbug was sort of a no brainer from a mostly paleo constitutionalist conservatism of course the jeffersons a sort of libertarian and paleos have always known wogs begin at calais
Lucian Reply:August 22nd, 2016 at 10:40 pm
I thought progs didn’t have families?
michael Reply:August 22nd, 2016 at 11:26 pm
I like to point out that what they call white privilege is earned social trust that even blacks extend whites because they know we can be trusted
SVErshov Reply:August 23rd, 2016 at 4:42 am
libertarians sometimes internally contested and rejected extremely potent concepts. for example like proposed by Wolff (1998) autonomous individual (unit). now we see as DARPA exploited same concept as form of AI and developed everything autonomous , drones, ships, vehicles, robots and even combat units. One such autonomous individual (Saudi origin) was sent to Russia and started there Chechen was , if not appearance of Putin at this time Russia would be not existent by now. Same person started war in Syrian.
it can be beneficial to bridge neo cam and philosophical anarchisms concept of justification of state violence and rejection of state legicimacy, thus opening the theoretical prospects for fragmentation and autonomy. same time removing political residues from neo cam state.
more can be found in “Philosophical anarchism and the paradox of politics”
Jeremy Arnold 2014
(N) G. Eiríksson Reply:August 23rd, 2016 at 2:39 pm
That´s quite intriguing, all the points. I´d hope you´d expand on it.
What, though, do you mean by ‘One such autonomous individual’?
Although I agree with everything in the article, it all seems so obvious to me that I feel like I didn’t learn anything.
Of course the question of the legality of secession is moot. Secession is upstream of legal questions.
But I guess this isn’t obvious to normal people? I guess it would actually make them feel better to see “You are allowed to secede” written down on a piece of paper? Hard to fathom, really.
Kwisatz Haderach Reply:August 22nd, 2016 at 6:20 pm
Also – am I to understand that there are some “libertarians” who don’t see secession as a self-evidently pre-political and eternally available option?
Or is the redemption here only in the fact one of them finally had the balls to state this case?
(Paging Peter Taylor for the libertarian angle…)
John Hannon Reply:August 22nd, 2016 at 11:56 pm
Not just libertarians thinking about secession –
Kwisatz Haderach Reply:August 23rd, 2016 at 4:44 am
The more the merrier!
Xoth Reply:August 26th, 2016 at 8:16 pm
But London belongs to the Duke of Westminster, doesn’t it? Well, a considerable part of it, at least.
secession is possibly the most feasible option , and is a way to reconcile libertarianism with NRX. The problem however is if the new state eventually becomes afflicted by the problem that afflicted the prior one
It´s certainly, it seems, never time to give up on the libertarian concept.
Most frankly, thus most accurately, it means one who propagates liberty.
We all know how essential that is to capitalism. Post-monkey trade & statecraft (secession) *is* Liberty.
And what is the technology of the production of liberty? NRx.
dale rooster Reply:August 23rd, 2016 at 4:38 pm
“And what is the technology of the production of liberty? NRx.”
I love this.
>>As is my wont, one day as I was engaged in casual conversation expounding upon my wisdom as pertains to everything, I inadvertently threw out a witty phrase. Darwinian Winnowing. Yes, yes, I know. Exactly the same as saying Survival Of the Fittest. Yet, my way contains a certain panache, yes? I’m all about style. Hey, even vulgarity has a certain style in the right circumstances. Observe the classic Sex Pistols song (I paraphrase here to clean it up-guess which word I’m substituting) with the line “hump this and hump that, hump it all you humping brat” or another one “mommy, I’m not an animal. I’m an abortion”. Now, granted, the angst of a English economy in severe decline did color the lyrics, but these few lines are indicative of a timeless observational style.
The folks at Vesuvius’ doorstep would have been the ancestors of today’s city preppers, had any of them survived. Here are two cities next to an active volcano, so you have got to wonder what those Eye-Talians were thinking in the first place, and then you had a population bumping buttholes to elbows and vacantly looking up at ominous planetary out-gassing and scratching themselves vigorously, then shrugging absentmindedly and going on with their business. After all, they reasoned, the mountain had shook and rattled and smoked before, and nothing much happened. All was well. No need to panic. And here is your modern city dweller, thinking exactly the same thing. And they are always right. Until they aren’t. You can’t time a volcanic eruption, nor an economic collapse or an imperial implosion or anything under mans or natures control. Timing is for schmucks, and those who listen to those that time are Darwinian speed bumps on our species road to ruin. Play the odds, don’t bet against them. And the odds are, on an overpopulated resource depleted planet, crowds are dangerous ( due given to Uncle Remus- we miss you brother, although you are in a better place [ retirement ] ).
There is also this!
Permission? No.Power? yes. I generally agree with the idea of more states as does Mises but Brett is right, the powerful won’t secede power voluntarily any more than an addict can stop using.
As Black Sam Bellamy put it
I am a free Prince, and I have as much Authority to make War on the whole World, as he who has a hundred Sail of Ships at Sea, and an Army of 100,000 Men in the Field … but there is no arguing with such sniveling Puppies, who allow Superiors to kick them about Deck at Pleasure; and pin their Faith upon a Pimp of a Parson; a Squab, who neither practices nor believes what he puts upon the chuckle-headed Fools he preaches to
Thing is Libertarians don’t have the power. Using L.P party membership as a guideline and assuming 10x as many people consider themselves Libertarian as are active in the party , that’s 4 million highly individualistic people in a sea of over 300 million
Low levels of cooperation do not a movement make.
All of them are enough for maybe two small states
However there aren’t that many Libertarian women nor women who want to be married in or live in such a state so its not really enough for s stable system short of them importing women
If they could hook up with the Constitutionalists and go for Auld American minrachy maybe they could pull it off but that is a big maybe.
Otherwise the future is going to be crack down till crack up or Fash if order can be maintained
>>[Prosthetic Pasts: H. P. Lovecraft and the Weird Politics of History] reads Lovecraft’s weird fiction in relation to his historically minded eighteenth- and early nineteenth-century precursors. In his essay “Supernatural Horror in Literature” (1927) the first text Lovecraft focuses on at length is Horace Walpole’s Castle of Otranto (1764), a supernatural tale that, he claims, exerted a virtually unparalleled influence on weird literature. Forming a distorted mirror image of Georg Lukács’s description of Otranto as a piece of costumery that nonetheless became the most famous historical novel of the eighteenth century, Lovecraft’s equivocal praise places Walpole in a tradition of cosmic horror that also includes Clara Reeve, William Godwin, and Walter Scott. Yet the relationship between Lovecraft’s fiction and these earlier writers of historical fiction has been more assumed than explored. Aware of history as a malleable and potentially destructive force, these precursors search for an alternative tradition to the “divine right” of kings on which to base the British constitution. In the process they both interrogate the idea of Anglo-Saxon liberty and exploit the progressive narratives of stadial history. Lovecraft follows their historical experiments in search of liberty, constructing a prosthetic past in an attempt to interpret the American people and their Constitution. Despite Lovecraft’s horror of labor unrest and miscegenation, his racist political vision is as a result haunted by the radical and progressive potential of these past traditions.
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